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0:18The Mina Kimes Show featuring Lenny, only NFL podcast.
0:21One of the hosts thinks one of the best tight ends of all time is named Shannon Sharpe.
0:27That's Lenny. I mean, it guys. I've been thinking about him.
0:30I've been thinking about a lot of old timey football players because I am completely addicted to all of these 17 and 0 games on the internet.
0:39Dan, are you playing this? Dan Pizzuta is joining me.
0:42Dan, are you, are you playing them as well?
0:45Dan Pizzuta I played a couple and then especially the football one got real frustrated with like the mechanics of what they liked and didn't like.
0:53Dan Pizzuta I was just like, I'm, I'm too competitive for this and I'm not gonna continue to waste my time.
1:00I'm also in the middle of FTN Almanac writing.
1:03Dan Pizzuta Yes. Dan Pizzuta So the free time that I have to play around with a game like that, very limited.
1:10So I tried to be responsible and cut myself off.
1:13Dan Pizzuta Can you tell me what divisions you're doing?
1:16Dan Pizzuta I am doing the AFC East as well as the Lions and Vikings.
1:21So six chapters for me this year. Dan Pizzuta Two teams that will come up today because we are doing NFC X factors.
1:28We did AFC X factors two weeks ago to remind people that's when we choose an X factor player for every team who is not a quarterback.
1:37Dan Pizzuta And then we took a week off because two gigantic trades broke, which was insane.
1:42Dan Pizzuta With the AFC dad, I did, I feel like way too many offensive linemen.
1:47And this time I actually didn't end up picking as many.
1:51I have a lot more like there's a few in the mix, but it's a lot more big names.
1:57Did you notice any tendencies in your picks before we dive in?
2:00Dan Pizzuta When I first started with the teams I had, like I wanted to put like the wide receiver two for
2:07every team and then kind of got away from that.
2:11So I think there's only like one that I have, but I think like that's a big thing that came up.
2:17But yeah, I tried to try to mix it up a little bit because these are some really interesting teams with a lot of ways you can go.
2:26Dan Pizzuta Well, I'll start right off with a wide receiver.
2:30I'll go first. I gave myself the Giants. I thought about some more obscure picks for this one.
2:35But it seems to me, if I think about a team, a player whose performance availability, etc, could swing the season and
2:42also when I say swing the season, that means a different thing for different teams, right?
2:47So when I think about the Giants, who I don't view as like a contender, sorry, Giants fans, I Dan Pizzuta I hope you don't think that either.
2:56But you know, a team that's like feels like they're on the rise, young quarterback, new coach, all of that.
3:03The thing I think that's most important is helping the young quarterback achieve success.
3:07And if Malik Neighbors ain't there, it's pretty concerning.
3:10So he is my X Factor pick. So for those who have not been paying attention, Neighbors, of course, was very hurt last year.
3:18When did that injury? It was late September. It was late September.
3:21The torn ACL and torn meniscus. The questions around when he is going to practice, when he will be ready for the season get a little concerning.
3:30I think it was a couple weeks ago that Adam Schefter implied that he might not be ready for week one.
3:37They're on Sunday night football against Dallas. And, you know, when you look at the rest of this receiving group without him.
3:44Pretty rough, pretty rough. We got the omnipresent, non-present, ever-present Darius Slayton, Calvin Austin, who I actually like Calvin Austin, Darnell Mooney.
3:51All these players are fine if Malik Neighbors is in the mix.
3:54But if he's not, Dan, this is a really, really weak group of receivers.
3:59Oh, sorry. OBJ. Right. Pardon me. OBJ. Malachi Fields, they drafted this year.
4:03Okay, sorry. Anyways, Juju Swishuster. I mean, if it's 2018, 19.
4:06We're doing all right. Yeah. So my point is just that, like, if Neighbors is in the mix, I feel good enough about the group around him.
4:15They also signed Isaiah Likely. He was a tight end.
4:18He was kind of like a big receiver. But if he's not, it's very concerning to me.
4:24Yeah, absolutely. And he completely changes the entire structure of what the offense is.
4:28Someone you actually have to pay attention to on the outside.
4:32And that's not someone they have at all if he's not on the field.
4:36So Dart only had 11 dropbacks with Neighbors on the field last year.
4:40So it's not like we can really see a lot of, like, what he did.
4:45But I think we do need a lot of development from what Jackson Dart can do.
4:50Because that is kind of my hesitation with what the Giants were.
4:54It was so many, so much of his, like, production came from the scrambles and the design runs.
5:00And we just kind of know that's not a way you can live.
5:04So on throws where, on plays where it was just a pass attempt or a sack, Jackson Dart dropped to, like, 28th in EPA per play.
5:12And that's not great when you're kind of asking him to throw the ball.
5:16So having Neighbors there as someone who can bail him out a little bit, someone he can trust, I think that's going to be a key.
5:25And if he is on the field, I think that certainly helps the offense.
5:29And obviously, like, if he's not, that's a real concern.
5:32Because I'm not sure if he can be living with those receivers and the tight ends, even if likely, like, does become
5:39a much better player and a bigger impact than he was in Baltimore.
5:43Yeah. Wandale Robinson was the primary volume eater, you know, once Neighbors went down.
5:48And he is, of course, gone. He is in Tennessee now.
5:51And yeah, like, it's funny because I liked the Giants draft, thought the two players they took in the first round were great picks.
5:59However, again, like, I liked it with Neighbors as part of the vision.
6:03And it's hard. It'll be like, I can't believe it'll be kind of hard to evaluate Dart without him with this group.
6:10Like you almost you know what I mean? Like, even last season, and I should I'm going to talk a lot more
6:17about him, you know, between now and when the season starts.
6:20And he had such kind of the highs, high highs early on.
6:24Some of that, you know, some of it was a lot of it was like you said, his athleticism and the scrambling,
6:31but I thought he also he impressed me as a pro, I think surprised me in some ways.
6:37I thought, you know, showed a lot of toughness, I thought through a very catchable football.
6:42But like, it's hard for you to imagine a world in which like that.
6:47And then there was a little bit of a drop off.
6:50There was a lot of a drop off after actually after the year went on and people kind of, but it was
6:57easy to write it off as well. Like, look at this team.
7:01Look at this offensive line. It's horrendous. Look at these.
7:04It's Wano Robbins is your number one. Okay, that's your one, right?
7:08Like, similarly to Calvin Ridley, we want to give him kind of like that rookie quarterback grace for the circumstances.
7:14But really circumstances should be pretty or not really probably.
7:17I see. I'm really good. Cam Ward. Ward circumstances should be improved in part because Ridley is not the number one.
7:24Whereas with Dart, it's like if there's no neighbors, I certainly not improved.
7:28Like even though I like the I think, I think the idea is they've invested in the offensive line and that the
7:35run game is going to be the focal point of this team with Dart being part of that.
7:41And that I think is a reasonable way, even with neighbors on the field, to look at this office.
7:47This should be a primarily like a run first offense.
7:50But again, it's just such a weak group without him.
7:53And I guess to talk about the player for a second, you know, he barely played last year.
7:59He had this incredible breakout rookie season, which by the way, speaking of target share, he was like, just insane number of
8:06targets that first season almost like overusing quite frankly.
8:09And then he only played in, you know, like three ish, three and a half games or whatever this year.
8:15And he had that week two game against Dallas where he went crazy and he was like kind of quiet after that.
8:22And then he got hurt. So it was just such for him as well.
8:27It was like a lost season and which should have been another year for him to like fully be like, okay, we're a top 10 receiver here.
8:35Cause he looked like he had that potential as a rookie.
8:39Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. You go back to what he was rookie.
8:42Yeah. The target show was 30.7% target on 31% of his routes, 41.6% of the Giants air yards.
8:48Like again, when you're running with Wondell Robinson's like your number two and he's getting every four yard throw that they have,
8:55like you, he's obviously someone who's going to be working down the field more and yeah, he's, he's awesome.
9:01And if he can be healthy. And I think the thing that scares you a little bit is that like, there was
9:08the second surgery and they needed to clean some things up.
9:11So like that just really makes you wonder when he's going to be healthier or when he's really going to be a
9:18hundred percent and on the field kind of running like he is.
9:22And again, for the Giants, I think you kind of need that superstar type of guy.
9:27Cause I don't really trust the offensive structure to be something that really helps.
9:32Not a, not a, yeah. Yeah. You can't sell me on that.
9:36So I think having someone like that who can be individually dominant is going to be a big piece in how much this giant's offense can improve.
9:44It's not like they hired Mike McDaniel where we're like, well, he'll cover up for, he'll find ways to get guys open.
9:51The run game will be creative. You know, it's yeah.
9:54A lot of questions around this giant's offense. But then I'll feel a lot better if neighbors is trending in the right direction at some point this summer.
10:03All right. You have the commanders. I don't know who you're going to, I have no idea where you're going to go in this direction.
10:11Yeah. Commanders was, was weird because there was just a lot of change over coming in here.
10:16So I'm going to go with the person that I think just kind of exemplifies what that change is.
10:23And I don't think I put made a top 10 pick anywhere else here, but like Sonny Stiles, I think is just
10:30going to be that guy just because of how important he looks like he's already going to be in the middle of that defense.
10:37Right. So they did like a massive change over, obviously.
10:40Dronson Jones is now the defensive coordinator who is like really tanking over the defense.
10:45He's going to be the play caller. This isn't going to be a Dan Quinn defense that just has a defensive coordinator.
10:52This is absolutely a shift into a lot of things.
10:55And they really changed out a lot of what they had on the defense where they were the oldest defense by snap-weighted age last season.
11:03And everyone they brought in was like much younger.
11:06Dofe always 28, Kilvon Chase on 27, Nick Cross 25, Leo Chanel like 26.
11:10So there's a lot of youth here and to get Sonny Stiles to put him in the middle of that defense, be
11:17able to play in a lot of different roles.
11:20Obviously he can, he's awesome moving forward. He has that safety background where he can still work well in coverage.
11:27I think that's going to open up Frankie Levu and Leo Chanel to do a lot of things.
11:32So I think having that type of player as the centerpiece of this defense just really opens up all of these things
11:39that they can do with a lot of new pieces in a new defense.
11:44If Stiles is anything close to what people think he can be, and I say people, I include myself in this group.
11:51This could be one of the best linebacking groups and maybe not immediately because it is a very hard position to play from the jump.
11:59But like you said, it's Chanel, Luvu as your pass rusher, and Stiles as the kind of versatile jack-of-all-trades.
12:05So you're going to call it like it really is an exciting front.
12:09And I say front, by the way, because I also like some of the additions that they made.
12:15You alluded to this. Like Chase on, I thought was kind of shockingly good in New England.
12:20And Odafe Owe, I think the risk there is like both of those players are a little bit like, okay, small sample size wonders maybe.
12:28Or do we feel good about, because Chase on is a bit of a reclamation.
12:33Owe was okay in Baltimore. Then he goes to LA and he kind of breaks out there in terms of getting pass rush production.
12:40But, you know, this should be – it's funny because this is a group that I think some people thought they might go after.
12:48The Washington defense pass rush was not sufficient last year, right?
12:51We all agree. They were a team that I think there was a thought they're going to be the Trey Hendrickson team or the trade for cross.
13:00Like they were going to go after that big money number one pass rusher.
13:05And instead, they're kind of doing it by committee a little bit.
13:08Not necessarily – you know, Owe got a big contract.
13:11But they're taking a few dart throws, which I think is an interesting approach.
13:16Those dart throws happen to be players that I like.
13:19And then if – again, if the linebacker group centers it, you could see a pretty significant leap, I think, from this front.
13:26I don't know if I'm buying the defense entirely.
13:29Like in the back end, I still have some questions about the secondary.
13:33But I like that they're making changes, new scheme, a lot of new players in the front.
13:39Like you said, an infusion of youth. But if Stiles struggles year one, it might not all come together as I'm painting it.
13:46Yeah, and I think that's the thing. If he is – I think if Stiles is good, this defense has a good chance of being at least average.
13:55Which I think if we look at what the offense could potentially be – and I just did a piece on Jaden
14:02Daniels that's going to come up soon. But going back into looking at what he was even last year was still really good.
14:09So a healthy Jaden Daniels, I think, makes this offense a lot better.
14:13And if this defense can be even average, it's a fun team that we might think is a little better than what we remember it being last year.
14:22It kind of gets into the mix a little bit.
14:25So I think that, yes, Stiles is – I think has just so much upside.
14:30And there's a chance that it hits. And I think this defense has a chance to at least be interesting, which it
14:37certainly wasn't like the past two years. Let me go to the offense really quickly.
14:42Did you consider McLaurin given the makeup of this group?
14:45Because you can – or do you feel better about the receiving group than say like New York?
14:51Because I just painted the picture like if there's no neighbors, it's bleak.
14:55What if McLaurin is hurt again like he was last year?
14:59How do you feel about this group of pass catchers?
15:02Yeah, that's certainly tough because McLaurin was really so – and I think we kind of saw it a little bit last year.
15:09And I don't think the receiving core particularly got better than it was last year when McLaurin was either injured or not fully 100%.
15:17And that connection with Jaden Daniels when the two played together in the very limited snaps just still wasn't there.
15:23So I think McLaurin is definitely a big piece of what is needed on that offense.
15:28I do have a little more confidence in what he can do with a full offseason.
15:33These guys have already been working out together in the offseason.
15:37They did some workouts in L.A. So I think a lot of what happened last year was with the holdout leading to
15:44the injury, then leading to the Jaden Daniels injury, and nothing really got on track.
15:48So I'm a little more confident in what that can be because outside of last year, McLaurin has been a pretty healthy receiver, so I'm not too worried.
15:57But I do think – like I said, I could have had the wide receiver too for every team like Treon Burks.
16:04I thought about Chica Conquo who could be kind of interesting as kind of that guy who runs in space a little bit.
16:12So yeah, I considered some pieces on the offense too.
16:15Yeah, I like Antonio Williams who was their third-round pick, the receiver out of Clemson.
16:20Kind of – he, I imagine, will play in the slot primarily for them.
16:24Gives you some quick game. Gives you some yards after the catch.
16:28I think he is a nice compliment to McLaurin, but McLaurin has to be out there for that to be the case.
16:35But yeah, I – Washington offense, there's like – it's part of this trend of like all these offenses moving in the
16:42Shanahan direction, McVay direction, the Eagles in their own division, Washington with David Blau now calling the plays.
16:47They've said Jaden's going to be more – I'm excited.
16:51Where's your piece coming out, by the way? I'm excited to read it.
16:55It is going to be at the Star, the new rebranding of Noticed.
16:59They're doing some more Washington Central stuff in some sports.
17:02So it should be up sometime. Send it out.
17:05Send it out. Soon. Okay. So – so we're doing these back-to-back.
17:09You did the first-round pick for the Commanders. I swear this is my only – I think this is my only first-round pick.
17:16Let me scroll, scroll, scroll. It is. Okay. So I just want to start off by saying that from this year.
17:23I'm going Caleb Downs for Dallas. I mean, yeah.
17:26You kind of have to, right? I mean, because he – Caleb Downs is, on paper, the answer to so many of
17:33the things that Dallas got wrong, not just last year, but has gotten wrong for years.
17:38Just to throw out some of the several ways in which the Dallas defense was a bit of a disaster.
17:44Run defense, we know it's been a problem, but I think it's worth highlighting again, and Downs is relevant here.
17:5031st in a second-level run defense, according to FTN.
17:5328th in the open field. They gave up 51 15-yard-plus runs.
17:57Only the Giants were worse in giving up explosive runs.
18:00Something that you imagine, Downs will be very good at helping is limiting some of those explosives.
18:05He's a phenomenal run defender. And then zone coverage.
18:08I want to highlight this because when I think about the Dallas Cowboys defense in 2025, something that I think about a
18:15lot is just it felt like everybody was always in the wrong spot or they were taking bad angles.
18:21They gave up 0.25 E-paper play, which was 32nd in zone coverage.
18:257.7 yards per play, which was also 32nd in the league.
18:28Again, Caleb Downs has many great qualities, but the thing, and I mentioned this around the draft, that jumps out is he
18:35puts people in the right position to play football in addition to being in the right position himself.
18:41He is a brilliant, brilliant young player. He's an excellent communicator.
18:45And I feel like just, again, to go to the explosive runs and then the zone coverage, guys being in the wrong
18:52spot, he really hypothetically, Dan, should solve those issues for Dallas.
18:55Yeah. I think you look at, do they have issues in the slot?
18:59Yeah. Do they have issues at linebacker? Yeah. Do you have some questions about what's happening in the defensive line?
19:06Yeah. Caleb Downs, all of that. Like he can't play everywhere, but I think the fact that you can have him be
19:13this queen on the chessboard is going to be just so magical for potentially what this Christian Parker defense can do.
19:19I think just watching Downs, and I think it's, you kind of, you watch him and he is someone who is more
19:26in like a, you know, the Buddha Baker type of thing, which he said himself.
19:31And I think a lot of people pre-draft were trying to be like, he's a Kyle Hamilton, Nick Eminwarri.
19:37He's not exactly that. But I think the more he's able to just kind of play downhill and just, he's so smart.
19:44He's always in, you can't like run a screen against him.
19:48It's just all of these things that he does so well.
19:51I think just does fix a lot of those problems that Dallas could be facing along that defense.
19:57Like you alluded to this, my only question is like, the only bummer is that you can't, you don't have three of him.
20:04Right. So I think it'll be interesting to see how Christian Parker utilizes him because he can play the nickel, as you alluded to.
20:12And I think in certain matchups, that is where you'll want him to be.
20:16When they play dime, he'll probably have them closer to the box.
20:20Right. And, and they, they signed Jalen Thompson as well, I think.
20:24Yeah. So, and I'll say PG lock. And then he can also play the post.
20:29So he can do multiple things. I think it's really just going to be like down a distance matchups, all of that.
20:36But like, he's just like a really good football player.
20:39I think like, you know, Dallas, it just feels like it's been so long since they had kind of, how do I put this?
20:46Like even when the Dallas defense was really good with Dan Quinn and they were very like kind of hair on fire getting after the quarterback.
20:55It didn't feel like smoke and mirrors. That's incorrect.
20:57But there were offenses who broke it pretty easily.
21:00Do you remember that? Right. Like Packers and stuff.
21:03And it just feels like, okay, you just, let's just, let's bring someone who is a floor raiser for everybody and make
21:10sure that like we're fundamentally sound and not getting, giving up, we're not busted coverages and giving up explosives.
21:16And Caleb Downs should hypothetically be that guy. Yeah.
21:19That those Dan Quinn defenses were a lot of like organized chaos, but it was, we're going to throw so much at
21:26you that you're going to get scared and turn the ball over.
21:30And that's kind of what they, they went on a lot.
21:33And when that didn't happen and offense could control it, that's when they got in trouble.
21:38And with, with Downs, it's just something where it's just, he can be everyone.
21:43And he, like, he just plays everything correctly, which again, like you said, is just not something that we have seen from Dallas all that often.
21:51Also potentially covers up or helps address what I still feel is an issue, which is linebacker.
21:57Yeah. All right. You have the Eagles wrapping up the NFC in East.
22:01Who did you pick? Okay. I went to a former Seahawk and it's Reekwollen.
22:05I think I could have gone a lot of places like on offense, but I think with just with so much, anybody
22:12could potentially be an X factor there, but Reekwollen specifically, because quarterback two was just a, like, it was a free space for opposing offenses.
22:20Yeah. The last year, the Eagles were second in DVOA against number one wide receivers and they were 24th against number two receivers.
22:27So, uh, Dory Jackson played that spot. And most times he was targeted on 18% of his coverage snaps, which was 131st
22:34out of 138 cornerbacks with at least a hundred coverage snaps.
22:38Um, he was 106th in adjusted yards allowed, which accounts for touchdowns and interceptions.
22:42And Wollin, you know, was targeted a bit just because of that, um, Seattle secondary.
22:47He was 41st in targets allowed per coverage snap, but he was 14th in adjusted yards allowed per coverage snap.
22:53And for someone that we just kind of publicly think of is this crazy inconsistent player.
22:58He's been in the top 20 in each of the past three seasons by that metric.
23:04And that's now at a position where it is very hard to be good.
23:08Uh, and among the best, uh, in like coverage statistics year to year, he's done it now three years in a row.
23:15So I think he is a much better player than a lot of people have given him credit for.
23:21And now that he only really has to shore up the cornerback two spot, I think is just kind of, it's one
23:28of those force multipliers for the rest of that defense.
23:31Cause now everyone else like can be better at their jobs because there's not this wide open space that opposing offenses can pick on.
23:39I really do think he's an underrated player. And I think part of the reason he has that reputation is just, he's
23:46given up some big plays or had some bad penalties, like in big moments.
23:50And those just are memorable to people as well as goober moments.
23:54Right. Um, but like, it kind of covers over all the times he isn't like he he's in great position or, I
24:01mean, he, he's such a unique, like for Eagles.
24:04I'm sure Eagles fans that you've kind of studied up on reek woolen, but because of his rare combination of size and
24:11recovery speed, even when he gets beat at the line of scrimmage or in cover, he has a chance to make a play in the football.
24:19And I think he's a great pick for Philadelphia because he's going to have a lot of opportunities, right?
24:25Like, so the Seattle secondary was great, but the other cornerback spot was Josh Jobe, who they decided to keep it pretty bargain price.
24:33Witherspoon is their star. Philadelphia is just CB two amongst the corners, Cooper, Jean and Quinn on Mitchell.
24:38They're like two of the best pairings in the league.
24:42So he's going to get thrown at, and this is a guy who is very good.
24:47You know, he's got a history of production and like he could potentially.
24:51Produce the kind of past breakups and turnovers that swing games.
24:54Um, it's an incredible opportunity for him. And he did a one year kind of prove it deal.
25:00So he is something to prove as well. And yeah, I feel like, you know, as this Eagles offense kind of figures
25:07things out and, you know, I talked about it a great deal with field last week, talking about the AJ Brown trade.
25:14And we're going to talk about it more because it's kind of one of the more interesting storylines in football.
25:20You trust Vic Fangio's defense to kind of pick up the slack.
25:24Yeah. And if you can tell me that they're last year, they were one of the three best defenses in football.
25:31If that continues, you're, you can give the offense a little bit of time to fully click.
25:36And yeah, he's a big, he, he's a big part of that.
25:40Um, I thought, I thought it was a really good signing personally.
25:44Yeah. It was one of my favorites of the off season.
25:47I think it kind of, you know, it was only one gear.
25:51So it's not like if he hits great, the Eagles get a lot more benefit just because he would be up on a contract.
25:59Again, but I think this has the chance. So like we're in the middle of the year and we're just, it's one of those.
26:06Why did the rest of the league let how we do this type of things?
26:11Because I do think he really has the potential to, to be really good in this defense and like help everybody else out.
26:19I think the pass rush now has more of a ability to, to get home.
26:23Uh, because again, like there's just not this open spot.
26:26That's so easy to pick apart. Yeah. All right.
26:29Well, we, this is kind of a good transition from the Eagles pass rush.
26:34They added Jonathan Grenard. Uh, I'm going to go to Minnesota here and we'll go to the NFC North and I'm going
26:41to identify a player who I think is very important in the wake of the Jonathan Grenard trade.
26:46And that would be Dallas Turner, who was their first round draft pick from a couple of years ago.
26:53Uh, barely played his rookie season. They traded up for him.
26:56Like, you know, it was, it was underwhelming last year.
26:59He played more, uh, as part of like kind of a rotation with, you know, they have Turner and Grenard and then Van Geekle, Andrew Van Geekle.
27:08Um, and it was kind of a mixed result, right?
27:11Like, so over the course of the season, nine sacks, six hits, 27 hurries, 42 pressures, kinds of middling ranks.
27:17Um, and then when you look at the advanced stats, they're also kind of like, you know, in the forties kind of.
27:24Uh, so I went back and watched cause a lot of his production came in the second half of the season and
27:31I wanted to watch just his pressures and see what they look like and see how it, cause my feeling, Dan was
27:38like the Grenard trade doesn't happen unless this team believes in Dallas Turner.
27:42Uh, especially with Kyler coming in where it's no longer like a quote unquote rebuilding year.
27:47Like you need pass rush. I know Brian Flores can turn, you know, anything into pass rush, but I, I felt like,
27:54and especially with all the change in Minnesota, I was like, no way Flores lets Grenard walk unless he feels like he's got something in Turner.
28:03Maybe I'm wrong. I'm just trying to, but like, you know, nobody even knew who's calling the shots right now.
28:09Right. Um, okay. So my big takeaway from watching him back and watching these pressures is he did feast a little bit on bad competition.
28:17In the second part of the season. I will say he has a lot of juice.
28:22He is explosive off the line of scrimmage and he has got closing speed.
28:27Like he is an athlete now, not a lot of high quality, not high quality is the wrong word.
28:33The pass rush repertoire is still a little bit underwhelming.
28:36There's a couple like, you know, nice long arm, nice rip here and there.
28:40But for the most part, the thing that just jumped out to me was the speed, uh, and the get off.
28:47So that's development has to continue next year because if it doesn't, I feel like they're really regretting trading Jonathan Grenard.
28:54Yeah. Yeah. It's tough because it felt like Grenard really was the, the one piece that they were able to get out
29:01of to free up some cap space. So it might've just been something that they needed to do regardless, but I do think they, that's true.
29:09They certainly have faith in, in Turner and they, they do need it because it's not just that he's stepping up into this role.
29:16If you look at their depth chart right now, it is Van Ginkle and Dallas Turner on the edge and behind them
29:23is Tyler Batty, who is a 2025 undrafted free agent and Bo Richter, who is a 2024 undrafted free agent.
29:30And that's their edge depth. And obviously in this Brian Flores defense, there's going to be a lot of moving pieces.
29:36There's a lot of blitzing. Like they blitzed on half of their snaps last year.
29:41Like the, no one blitzes like Brian Flores in, in different ways and with the guys who were coming in and they
29:48go really deep at like off ball linebacker and guys who can pass rush.
29:53But again, to have someone on the edge, you really need that and be able to win some of those one-on-ones that
30:00are created because of some of those blitz looks.
30:02And you're really asking, it was a rotation last year, but right now, and obviously that, you know, you could have like a veteran come in.
30:11I think there's still a couple of veteran pass rushers at this point just to add to the group.
30:17But right now you're asking a lot of Van Ginkle and Turner.
30:21We've seen Van Ginkle do it. He can definitely do it in that Flores defense.
30:25You do need a little more of Turner for this to be a defense that stays as good as it is.
30:32And, you know, kind of part of the chapter that I wrote for it for the Vikings is the projections are kind
30:39of expecting the Vikings defense to drop down to closer to average a little bit after being a top three defense in DVOA the past two years.
30:48And again, they're just kind of asking a lot of players to step up.
30:52And Turner, if he can step up and be, you know, what they thought he was going to be as a first-round
30:59pick, that's what gives them the potential to be one of those better defenses in the league again and kind of stave off that regression a little bit.
31:08Yeah, they're a team where even if, like, let's say you drop from top five to top ten-ish range, the hope, I
31:15think, is the offense picks up the slack, right?
31:18But, yeah, I just, like, look, Brian Flores, if we're doing a defensive coordinator draft, he's – it's interesting because I think,
31:25like, different guys you want for different types of defenses, different talent levels.
31:29He perhaps is the one out of everyone where you're like, you could just take anything and turn it into something, right?
31:36But it gets to a point where – and, like, they did draft Caleb Banks in the first round.
31:42We'll see, you know, what they get out of him and if they're able to get more interior pass rush and all that.
31:49But I think this is it for Turner. It's kind of for him as well, right?
31:54Like, doesn't it feel like it's year three? You got to – this is it.
31:59You got to break out now if you want that big money contract.
32:03So we shall see. And I think – when I think about, like, the NFC North, which kind of feels like a
32:10division in flux, if the Vikings are going to be competitive and I'm closing my eyes and imagining it, it starts with Kyler, you know?
32:18But then the second thing I would say is a player like Dallas Turner picking up the slack on defense.
32:24All right, you have the Lions team very much in flux.
32:28Yeah, absolutely. So I – this is the one where I did go with a wide receiver and it's a weird one
32:35kind of breaks into a little bit more. I'm sure of their philosophy here, but I have Isaac Tesla.
32:41And it's – okay. Partly because – I don't know.
32:44All right. He was, again, a fun rookie. Made a lot of, like, crazy catches.
32:49But under a yard per route run. But 11 of his 27 targets were in the end zone and those ended up with six touchdowns.
32:57So how he develops, I think, is going to be important for the Lions philosophically because it's how much do they want to be running 11 per second.
33:06They brought in Drew Petsing to be the offensive coordinator.
33:09He's someone in Arizona who was running a lot of, you know, 12 and 13.
33:14Probably would have run even more 13 last year if Tip Ryman did not get hurt.
33:19So this is something where I expect them to want to lean into 12 personnel a little more.
33:24When you look at what Jameer Gibbs has been as a runner, he's been a much better runner out of 11 personnel because of that spacing.
33:33So last year on 87 early down carries from 11 personnel, Gibbs averaged 6.5 yards per carry and 10.8% DVOA.
33:39On 88 carries from 12, he averaged 3.7 yards per carry and a 34% success rate and negative 23.9% DVOA.
33:45So I think that's underrating Gibbs a little bit because I think the offensive line was really in flux last year.
33:52I think he has the ability to create some of his own space between the tackles.
33:57But I do think throughout his career, he's been a much better runner being able to spread some things out and taking
34:04advantage of some of that space from 11 and the way they've been able to figure out how to get him, you know, space in the run game.
34:13So in this league that I think is shifting more to 12 and 13, I think that is something that the Lions will benefit from.
34:21How often the Lions want to be in 11, I think could potentially be something that really impacts how explosive the run
34:28game can be as we see Gibbs take way more carries than he did last year.
34:33If you had to pick a player, I like what you're thinking there, by the way, and it is kind of an interesting zag from the line, right?
34:42Like as the league does go to using more multiple tight end sets, if they were leaning a little bit into using
34:49the three receivers, because the other two are obviously very good.
34:52I'm not saying round Jameson Williams. But it does feel like that vision is predicated on functional offensive line play.
34:59If you had to pick one player on this offensive line, who you think is the X factor?
35:04I thought you were going to pick a lineman.
35:07Who would you pick of the five? Yeah, I was thinking about it.
35:11I think, I mean, I have faith in Cade Mays being good, but he's probably who I would pick just because it
35:18is so much of that interior and being that centerpiece, quite literally, of that offensive line, I think is going to be really important.
35:26And that was a position that was really in flux last year.
35:30And I think a good center would help the two young guards a little bit.
35:35And I think if, you know, you penny Sewell, I'm not worried about transitioning to the left side.
35:40I feel fine. Sewell, Mahogany. And then the right side, you're like, you go from Mays at center to Ratledge to Blake Miller, who they drafted this year.
35:49That's a young right side. And yeah, I think if this thing all falls apart, I do feel like it's going to
35:56be on that side of the offensive line. But alternatively, it could be great.
36:01Yeah. And I originally, so I actually originally did have Miller when I first did my first draft of this.
36:07But then I decided to go this route because I think the offensive line plays a important part here.
36:13If they do need, you know, more tight ends to be attached to the line, maybe create some of a longer surface
36:20area for Gibbs because you need to make up for, you know, what Miller is doing on the right side.
36:26And you just need a little more help there.
36:29I think all of this just kind of plays together.
36:32And what Detroit ends up being philosophically is really interesting to me and how they want to run this offense and also
36:39how they keep the personnel in place. Because I think they could potentially run 13, but I also don't think they want
36:46to take Jameson Williams off the field like at all.
36:50So the push and pull of who they have and what they want to do, I think is super interesting this year.
36:57Packers, there's two injured players who I could have easily chosen.
37:00Micah Parsons, obviously, who now were Adam Scheff. I think somebody was reporting might not be ready till like October.
37:06That's deeply concerning. He is like one of the more load-bearing players in the NFL, I always say.
37:12Tucker Craft is another player. I'm very interested in his health and availability and how he looks early on because he was
37:19such the focal point of that offense. And he's so good and also gave them kind of, I think, an identity that
37:26if he's not on the field, they have to evolve.
37:29But I'm going to go with a different player and I'm going to pick a receiver.
37:34I'm going to go with Christian Watson, who just got the four-year $110 million contract extension.
37:39So this receiving group has let some guys walk out the door, notably Romeo Dobbs, who was kind of like the steady Eddie of the bunch.
37:48And then Datavian Wicks as well. And so they went from having like too many guys, too many mouths to feed.
37:54But is there a number one to like a pretty concrete one, two, three.
37:59Yeah. Watson, Golden, Reed, who they also play Jaden Reed.
38:02You know, they have Sabian Williams, this guy Moore.
38:05But yeah, those are the three. And I picked Watson because I just really think this Packers offense is so different when he's not on the field.
38:13And it kind of gets underplayed a little bit.
38:16And obviously, he's had injuries since coming into the NFL that have made it a big storyline for this team.
38:23But like I pulled his on and off numbers out of curiosity.
38:27And I did the entire his entire career. So to get a large sample size.
38:31So 2022 through 20, 20, 25. When Christian Watson is on the field, the Packers offense is.
38:37Second in yards per attempt. First in yards per play.
38:40Fourth in EPA per play. And third in first down rate.
38:43So this is a top four offense. When he is off the field.
38:47They are 16th in yards per play. 19th in first down rate.
38:5113th in yards per attempt. They're 19 EPA per play.
38:54So like, I feel that if you could tell me Christian Watson is going to play 17 games for the Green Bay Packers.
39:02I think I'd be like, you know what? I have some concerns about the offensive line.
39:07Tucker Craft. Whatever. But that's probably enough for me to feel good about this offense.
39:12Based on what we've seen. But if he's not.
39:14You know, if there's an injury or whatever. You get worried about where they're going.
39:19Yeah. It's so clear what the Packers are when he's on the field.
39:23And how he impacts what they're able to do.
39:26Being able to be that long outside vertical threat.
39:29That is explosive. And I think there were some people that saw the contract that he got.
39:34And were a little surprised by how much money he got paid.
39:38But explosives matter so much in this league. So last year when there was at least one play in a drive.
39:45That went. Or pass play. That went over 16 yards.
39:4846.8% touchdown rate on that drive. And a 70.8% scoring rate on those drives.
39:53So that is at one play or more of 16 or more yards through the air.
39:58Without one. So zero plays of 16 or more yards through the air.
40:02A 10% touchdown rate per drive. And 21% scores per drive.
40:05So you just see one explosive just changes everything that you can do on an offense.
40:10Especially with the new kickoff rule where you're already starting closer to the goal line.
40:15Usually starting at least like on the 35 or around the 30 somewhere.
40:19And like one explosive puts you in field goal range.
40:22And that's what Christian Watson has been for this offense when he is on the field.
40:28And you have a quarterback like Jordan Love who is, has no hesitation to push it down the field.
40:34Yeah. When, when he's there. So it's just the combination of those two work out so well.
40:39And that's why they are so efficient when he is on the field.
40:43Yeah. I'm glad you brought up Jordan Love, right?
40:46Because he is a quarterback who's aggressive and throw the ball downfield.
40:50And Watson is his guy on those concepts. And, and that's the identity of the Packers offense.
40:55When it's clicking, it's deep balls and then yards after the catch.
40:59So like Watson and Kraft being on the field at the same time.
41:03Reed, he was also a great guy. You know, it is.
41:07And we'll see what they get from Matthew Golden who kind of came alive at the end of the season.
41:13But yeah, it's just, it's just very different. It feels a lot more congested.
41:17He clears room when he's not on the field.
41:20And I'm, I kind of the opposite of what I was saying about like the Eagles.
41:25Like I think this Packers defense could really struggle at the beginning of the year.
41:30So the offense is going to have to pick up the slack.
41:34I think until Micah Parsons gets back to being Micah Parsons.
41:37All right, let's wrap with the bears. You have the bears.
41:41Who did you pick? I picked Austin Booker. That's a good pick.
41:45Yeah. So bears were 29th in pressure rate last season with the ninth highest blitz rate.
41:50So not, not a lot going on in the, in the pass rush category there.
41:55So Montez Sweat had 28.9% of the bears pressures overall, which ranked 13th.
41:59The next highest bear was Gervin Dexter at 20.3.
42:02So Booker hurt his knee in the second week of the preseason and missed the first seven games of the season.
42:08But when he was on the field, he actually accounted for 29% of Chicago's pressures, 27.3% of the quarterback hits.
42:15And Sweat was second for both of those. So I think that the bears are really banking on him to, to step up.
42:22They didn't make any moves really in free agency or in the draft to get a like number two edge to go next to Sweat.
42:30So I think they're just really banking on him to, to step up and, and be that type of guy that they
42:37can rely on to get after the quarterback. And he's flashed when he's been on the field.
42:42I just did not really get that consistently coming off the injury last year.
42:47It didn't play a lot in his rookie year.
42:49Uh, so I think this is another year three guy that they're really banking on a lot.
42:55If you told me that Booker has double digit sacks, then I think this is probably a good defense because the secondary is, I think could be awesome.
43:04Right? So they didn't add to pass rush, but they did draft Dylan Thienemann.
43:08They signed Kobe Bryant. So the safety group is going to look very different.
43:13Jalen Johnson, Tyreek Stevenson, Kyler Gordon, when they all play, we know are a grid, a talented group of corners.
43:19Yeah, they all missed so much time last year too.
43:22So much time. This was a defense that was very turnover dependent last season.
43:27They're a prime regression candidate because of that, unless they can get more pass rush production from one of these players.
43:33Cause yeah, like the big, I think one of the biggest surprises I talked about this, I think when I was after
43:40the draft talking about like groups where I thought they still had big holes was that the bears didn't add to the,
43:47I think they wanted to, and it just didn't work out.
43:51Um, so this is a little bit of a bet on internal talent and we'll see.
43:56I mean, I, I agree though. He is the one that I would pick as well as the ones kind of exciting and there's some potential there.
44:04All right. Let's take a quick break. Come back and let's do the NFC West next.
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46:04NFC West. I'm going to go first. This is going to be the only podcast in the history of podcasts that's going
46:11to start the NFC West with the Cardinals. This is something I'm going to do the Cardinals first.
46:16I think this is an easy one. Marvin Harrison Jr.
46:19Yeah. Yeah. So, earlier I talked about swinging the division.
46:23Cardinals are not going to be good. And nobody thinks that.
46:26In fact, they might be so bad that they get a quarterback next year, which makes Harrison even more important.
46:32Because I'm not only thinking about this season. Oh, by the way, you see Jacoby Brissett finally reported.
46:38And there we go. Yeah. It's over, guys. We're free.
46:41But for next season as well, right? Like, this is – if Harrison Jr.
46:46shows something this year, you feel better about next year, the receiver or the quarterback walking into, you know, not feeling like,
46:53gosh, we've got to really fix this receiving group.
46:56Because Michael Wilson's a nice player. You've got Trey McBride.
46:59He's one of the best young tight ends in football.
47:02But Harrison Jr. has just been woefully inconsistent. That's how I would describe him since he came into the NFL as the fourth overall pick.
47:10I was as high on him as any prospect, honestly.
47:13I'm not ashamed to admit it because college tape was freaking incredible.
47:17And he's been – it's been very up and down.
47:20And I think there's questions, Dan, like about, like, why is he up and down?
47:25Like, how much of it is him versus quarterback versus chemistry?
47:28Yep. But, like, last year, you know, he had a couple of big games, like similar to the previous year against Dallas and Indianapolis.
47:36But a lot of games where he didn't do a ton.
47:39I went back and watched him a little bit just to kind of try to, I don't know, revisit maybe like what it was.
47:47You know, just – Yeah. Is he being misused?
47:50And I will say – I don't – I won't say like he was horribly misused, although there were times where he
47:57was just kind of like, hey, you know, clear it out, sacrificial.
48:01But I do think his particular skill set, and maybe we didn't know this coming into the league, is not something that
48:08they totally leaned into, which is watching him. I felt he was the best on, like, in breakers, crossers, digs, slants.
48:14And there weren't a ton of those in the offense with Kyler.
48:18And so I do think that maybe this could have been a little bit of like a quarterback receiver, not quite the same skill set.
48:26I'm not sure if the quarterback situation this year is going to lend itself towards answering these questions, but I do think
48:33it's possible that we could see more out of Marvin Harrison Jr.
48:37if he is used in a slightly different fashion.
48:40Yeah. And I think like the main thing that it goes back to for Marvin Harrison for me is his rookie year
48:47where they just like forced those back shoulder balls down the field that him and Kyler just had zero chemistry on.
48:53Yeah. And negative chemistry if that was possible. They just like always looked out of sorts, but they just continually like spam
49:00that and tried to make that a thing. And it didn't really work.
49:05And when, when Brissette was in last year, so Marvin Harrison actually had lower yards per route run with Brissette than he did with Kyler last season.
49:13It did not have as many in breakers. So you would think that maybe it changed a little bit, but it didn't change in that way.
49:21But I do think this year with Michael Floor as a kind of running that offense, I do think we are going
49:28to get more, not only just him moving around from the outside, have him in a little bit.
49:34I think there's just going to be more versatility in what he's doing.
49:38And just in the previous two years, he was just so much of that outside guy who ran down the field.
49:45And like you said, that just does not fit his game in the way that we all kind of thought it potentially could be.
49:53And I don't think like any receiver really would have worked that well in the role he was really asked to play, especially with the surroundings around him.
50:01But I do have, I'm still holding out hope that a change in being a little more versatile will certainly help him
50:08get, because he was, he was awesome. It still doesn't really like completely translate to me how we got the receiver that
50:15we saw in college to what we've seen in two years in the NFL.
50:20It does not look nearly like the same guy.
50:23The reps where you see like a one or where it looks really good.
50:27And I, you know, I mentioned like, again, like the crossers, the slants or whatever.
50:32I just think his size, his, he has like good, like he's able to use his frame to box guys out.
50:39He doesn't, he's not an elite separator, even a great separator, but there are moments where you can see that he still
50:46has a unique movement abilities at his size to break guys off at the top.
50:50And I just think if he could get anywhere close to what we expected this next season, then whether it's Arch Manning
50:57or whoever next year, you're like, okay, cool. We have Martin Harrison, Jr.
51:01Michael Wilson, Kendrick Barnes, who they got the third of the year they added this year.
51:07I feel, we feel good. Right. But if he's not, it's like, ah, we got to really work hard to improve the
51:14situation that our young quarterback is stepping into. You have the San Francisco 49ers.
51:18Who is your choice? Yeah. It's Mike Evans because like it's Mike Evans on the 49ers.
51:23Like really, really cool. Yeah. And like every, everyone coming like out of Tampa Bay is just like, yeah, we, we hate it.
51:30We didn't think it was ever going to happen.
51:33And what did Chris Godwin say? He thought it was AI when he first saw it.
51:38Like, I think everyone is very heartbroken in Tampa, but I think this can be really fun if it works out in
51:45a way for the, the 49ers, again, like just this outside vertical, you know, one-on-one type of receiver that San Francisco hasn't really had.
51:53And I think when you kind of go back to when this offense was really good, like the like record breaking one,
52:00like 2023, like that outside verticality of like brand, and Iuke was really important, not only to like getting him the ball,
52:07but it also opened up the middle of the field.
52:10And that's when McCaffrey and, you know, George Kittle were able to do some things because you had someone that you really
52:17had to worry about on the outside. And Mike Evans is like that to now in extreme over what Iuke was.
52:24So I think when, when you can do that and, you know, Purdy is already a guy who wants to like rip
52:31the ball when he can, especially like on third downs.
52:34And Mike Evans is going to be that guy now.
52:37And I think that just adds the element to this passing offense that really has not been there in like this version of the Shanahan offense.
52:45It's going to be so weird. you know, I, I feel like of all the changing teams guys, that's the one where
52:52I'm not going to like Hendrickson in a Ravens, you know, some of the like more notable players.
52:58That's the one where I'm going to be like, what?
53:01And then I guess miles Gary over retired, the Rams in a Ramster.
53:05I don't know why that doesn't feel as weird to me as like, maybe just cause I, even though miles Garrett was
53:12like a lifelong or he was a Brown for so long.
53:16I just think like Mike Evans box. I mean, it's just like, yeah, we've like fantasy traded miles Garrett for years.
53:22So like, I've seen, I've seen ad photoshops of, I don't think I ever saw that with, with Mike Evans.
53:29I just never, I thought he was going to retire a buck, but yeah, I mean, the craziest thing is like the
53:36San Francisco, Brian, I was often, like I talked about this last year, even with out Brock pretty at times, they were still unbelievable.
53:43Even all the many injuries that they had, was it killed at the end?
53:48No having I you, this was still a top like three offense.
53:52And again, even with all that, they were fifth in red zone and now they have Mike Evans.
53:57Like that's potentially could be really crazy. I think at times too, as good as they were last year, it did feel
54:04like, like you said, there, it was a little bit congested.
54:08Like they didn't have somebody to really create space.
54:11And I think hypothetically, like you said, I think 2023, it's a great example of like going back to the offense status
54:18layer, which was kind of the first year we're like, Oh, not first year, but it was a reminder.
54:24Oh, here's where Brock Purdy is different from other Niners quarterbacks.
54:27And having a receiver who caters to that is really valuable.
54:31I'm going to go Seahawks. And I am, it's funny.
54:34I thought about Josh Jobe actually, which would have been kind of the opposite side of the requel and thing, but I'm going to go with Abe Lucas.
54:43Who's the right tackle. I do not think it was maybe appreciated enough.
54:47How big of a role. Abe Lucas playing the entire season had in the Seahawks winning the Super Bowl.
54:53Yeah. Abe Lucas, who was their third round draft pick, who was awesome as rookie season, and then was injured the next two years.
55:01For much of them was really like the straw that it was the offensive line without him has been really bad last year.
55:08So his last season, he, in the entire season, he gave up, I was just using the, the PFF data here, three
55:15sacks and, and one hit in 20. The prior season, 2024, when he missed 10 games, the offensive tackles, the offensive tackles,
55:22he replaced him stone Forsyth, Mike Jarrell, George Fant, old friend, gave up seven sacks and six hits in half of the season.
55:29So they gave up combined more than double what he did last year.
55:33Not even, you know, over seven games. Last year, I thought this was notable.
55:38And if I, cause it felt right rushing to the right side, the Seahawks average 5.3 yards per carry, which is 10th
55:45in the NFL rushing to the left 4.1, which was 27th.
55:48So his presence, both in terms of protecting Sam Darnold, but also on the ground was a massive game changer for this offensive line.
55:56Right guard is still a chilling proposition center. Sundell's fine.
55:59But if you can tell me that you get another full season out of Abe Lucas, I think they'll be fine.
56:06However, he's been injured. So I just want to throw that.
56:09Like when they did the contract, people were like, Oh, that guy always gets hurt.
56:14And then he played an entire full healthy season.
56:17I just think he's so important to this offense.
56:20And if you take him out, you're like, Ooh, this reminds me a lot of 2024.
56:25Yeah. It's kind of just like you said, there's so many different factors that go into having him healthy.
56:31Looking at the FTN numbers, he was eighth among right tackles in pressure rate allowed.
56:36And that's super important in front of Sam Darnold, who we know is one of the most, you know, pressure dependent quarterbacks that we have in the league.
56:44Then you, again, like you said, with Anthony Bradford next to him, having a stable force, being able to kind of help
56:51him out a little bit, that obviously did not help when, you know, he had some interior rushers that were picking on
56:58the Seahawks in that way, but to have a stable right tackle there and not have to worry about a backup right tackle and having him.
57:07And again, I think it's, we're going to have to lean on that really early in the season when you're working in,
57:14you know, a Jadarian price in the backfield who is going to have to, you know, have a little more of a,
57:21you know, probably get on the field and have more carries than he would have otherwise.
57:26And so I think just having as much of a stable offensive line as you can for that time being, it's going
57:33to be really important for, for Seattle. Yeah. I mean, Brian Fleury, who like nobody seems to know that much about, he's taking over for Clint Kubiak.
57:41The assumption is he's going to kind of copy and paste a lot of it.
57:46Right. But if you saw this with, I think, you know, Ryan Grubb, there was a few things like he was flawed,
57:53but I also think he was dealt a pretty bad hand with that offensive line as a first time NFL play caller and without a Lucas.
58:01Right. And if you, again, like if you could tell me that the CX will get the same consistency, same starting five,
58:08even with the guard being question mark or Bradford being, you know, bad.
58:12I feel okay, but I don't feel okay. If a Lucas is not on the field.
58:18All right. You have the Rams to wrap up the division.
58:21Who is your choice? All right. So we're, we're sticking on the offensive line here and I'm going to have Warren McClendon.
58:28It's a great choice. Who had stepped in really well for Rob Havenstein last year.
58:33And I think like really went underrated how good he was.
58:36If you just kind of look at what he was in the, like all the win rates, he was 12th in pass block win rate among tackles.
58:45He was second in run block win rate among tackles, which is so huge for what this Rams team wanted to do.
58:52Last year, when so much of their offense with the heavier personnel was just, we are going to have successful runs that
58:59keep us ahead of the sticks, putting up with one of the best rushing success rates that we've seen in like over a decade.
59:06Um, or at least, you know, in the true media, uh, the era that, that we have, um, it was, it was so big.
59:14And not only with that, keeping Matthew Stafford upright is a very important piece of what the Rams are.
59:20So to have a tackle who was able to come in, be play as well as he did, and now have the,
59:27uh, opportunity to be the starter there on that side of the, the offensive line, I think is going to be really
59:34big for what they can potentially do on offense.
59:37I think offensive tackle is like the only potential hole in death star here.
59:41If, uh, anything happens or decline in play injuries, whatever.
59:45And again, you could say that of every team, but the other teams aren't the death star.
59:50Okay. Like I actually think for all of this, the, you know, hand wringing around the Rams, not taking McKay lemon or
59:57a receiver, you could take Adams tight end, Nakua for a limited amount of time.
60:02And I think, you know what? Sean McVay can make this work.
60:06This work, but if you take these, one of these linemen out, that's when I get worried because like you said, so
60:13much of this Rams offense is predicate. They're dedicated on being a hyper efficient rushing team.
60:18Um, and they have a quarterback who's, you know, like you said, like he's, he's older, he needs pass protection.
60:24It's the one thing I think that could stop this, uh, freight train.
60:28So great choice. They've been incredibly, I mean, less need to his credit finding, um, you know, these offensive lines, like they're
60:35not premium picks outside of a Vila. Uh, we've been incredibly successful at finding, developing young offensive linemen.
60:41Um, but the depth is, the depth is, I feel better.
60:44And I know these players because a lot of them are playing the Raz preseason.
60:49I feel better about the death on the interior than I do at tackle as well.
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62:06Ask for O'Reilly Veriscan today. All right. Let us wrap with the NFC South.
62:10I'm going to go first. Emeka Egbuka. Yeah. Is his name right?
62:14Emeka? Is it Emeka? I can't remember. Yeah, I think that's right.
62:18Egbuka. I know I'm saying his last name right.
62:21So I want to have a conversation about him and what happened last year because I don't think I really like took
62:28a moment during the season to like step back and discuss this first few weeks of the season.
62:34He looks like not just the runaway rookie of the year, one of the best receivers in football.
62:39And then like Evans gets hurt. He's fine. But then the production starts dropping, dropping, dropping.
62:44And in this final 12 games, he's held below 50 yards and nine of them questions.
62:49I think, and this is the conversation part of it.
62:53Why is an interesting discussion? Is it Mayfield, Baker Mayfield?
62:56Is it more attention on Egbuka? Is it the competition he faced?
63:00And sadly, my answer is a little bit of all of the buff.
63:04Yeah. I went back and watched his, all of his targets from the first five weeks.
63:09So I think he was awesome, but it is worth noting.
63:12Most of them were against inferior competition. Week one, AJ Terrell didn't cover him.
63:17That was Atlanta. Week two, the Texans actually limited him pretty good.
63:21He scored on a screen. And then week three, he had one nice tight window catch against sauce, but otherwise it was
63:28not against him for the most part. Week four, he was not Quinian Mitchell.
63:32His wins were not against Quinian Mitchell against the Eagles.
63:35Week five, he got Josh Jobe and it was all Seattle backups in the secondary.
63:40Um, so I think there was like a little bit of great inflation going on with some of the, the guys who played him.
63:48And then the other thing I'll say is this, cause then I watched, um, like the, I was curious about the Patriots
63:55game week 10, cause he had a lot of, he put up a lot of yards against them and he actually ate
64:02up Gonzalez a little bit underneath when he was playing zone.
64:05And I think if I had to pinpoint one thing with Egbuka, it's this, I think he is much better right now against zone than man.
64:13Uh, and that is born out in the numbers against zone.
64:17He was 22nd in yards per route run against man.
64:20That was 61st against off. He was 17th against press.
64:23He was 64th. And I do think as the year went on, defense is kind of keyed on that a little bit.
64:30And corners were able to get push him around and look at him a little bit of a hard time.
64:36So spending it forward to this year and like, can he be the dude?
64:41Cause Mike Evans gone. Dan, I would posit this.
64:44They shouldn't use him like Mike Evans. Cause he's not Mike Evans.
64:48And I think that's a really important thing to mention when we kind of look at what happened last year and ask,
64:55how do we get back some of that early season success?
64:58Yeah. And it does seem like when you hear what they're talking about out of, you know, Buccaneers camp, that they are
65:05going to use him more as like a Z and move him around a little bit and not have him be some
65:12outside X receiver that they're asking to win man coverage.
65:15And like you said, going into it, when you just split the season in half through week nine, 19% of his routes
65:22were against man from week 10 on that jumped up to 24%.
65:26He was getting targeted much less against man to 31.4% of his man routes.
65:30He was getting targeted on the first half of the season that dropped to 18.8% in, in the second half.
65:37So that is like really a big thing of what they were doing.
65:41They were manning them up more. He wasn't getting as open.
65:44Inaccurate passes were, were more too. So it was just, everything kind of just went wrong a little bit for what he
65:51was doing in the second half of the season.
65:54But I do, I like what I think Zach Robinson can potentially do with him.
65:59And I do, it sounds like they do have a plan to get him just more open.
66:04I get him some more space around the line of scrimmage.
66:08So he is able to just kind of work in those underneath areas that I think can just free him up a
66:15little more, play more to his skillset. And I think that is certainly going to be something that he does well.
66:22You know, and for all the criticisms that Gromerson in Atlanta, a lot of it deserved.
66:27I do think he was pretty good at utilizing Drake London and finding ways to get him open and get him opportunities.
66:34And yeah, I love hearing that because he is excellent against zone.
66:37I'll mention that as well. Like he's got such a great spatial feel.
66:42He's got quarterback friendly hands, you know, it's really just, yeah.
66:45So you, you want to keep him clean. And I do think it's a little bit of an awkward fit.
66:51Like the, well, if he's the Z and God wins the slot, I guess McMillan is sort of lining up outside and,
66:58and it's, it'll be interesting to see how it all shakes out.
67:02But, but I'm still, I still think the arrow is pointing out.
67:06I still think he's incredibly talented. I just think like when I went back and looked at like the course of the
67:13season, I was like, okay, like some of this early on was a little bit, a little bit like misleading.
67:19And then some of it later on, I think was a little bit unfair as well.
67:24So, all right. I'm still optimistic about the player.
67:27You have Atlanta. Who did you choose? I have no idea what to make of the Falcons.
67:33Yeah, this was a tough one, but I ended up with Jalen Walker, just because of a lot of things that are going on with their defensive line.
67:42Obviously not having James Pierce, you know, so Walker had a impressive rookie season, like five and a half sacks, two strip
67:49sacks, which, you know, there was some impact there.
67:51He came in, like kind of hailed for his versatility is kind of one of those guys that was able to, he
67:58played off ball, but I can rush the passer, but he played 98% of his snaps on the edge last year.
68:05And I think Atlanta has said they maybe were a little too conservative with him, trying not to put too much on
68:12his plate last year, trying to let him learn one position that he would play well.
68:17But he still, you know, only rush the passer on 85% of his past snaps.
68:22So he's still dropping back into coverage a little more to use that versatility.
68:26But it seems like as they're talking, you know, through some of this off season work, they, they want to move him around a little more.
68:35And like, he is still like the number one pass rusher just based on how the depth chart goes.
68:41But, and so they're probably not going to make him like Caden Ellis in a way that he was an off ball
68:48linebacker who moved around all the places. So I think Walker is probably going to move around the front a little more
68:55and then can pop up in, in some other places.
68:58I, and I think the way they are going to use his versatility, I think when now you are down the other
69:05pass rusher that you thought you would have, like it's only Samson, a Bukum and Aziz Ojolari as the other edges, how
69:12effective Walker is going to be, is going to be really important.
69:16Cause this defense was actually surprisingly 12th in DVOA.
69:18Yeah. That season. So I think there are some pieces here that can work.
69:23And if, if Walker can have some kind of expanded role where the versatility he did have is now more weaponized than
69:30it was last season, I think that could be a fun piece that you play around and it makes some of those
69:37other pieces fit a little better into the defense along the front too.
69:41Has the leak come down on what's going to happen with James Pierce Jr.
69:45at all. I don't, I saw that he was offered and this was in April was around the draft.
69:52I remember he entered like an intervention program. Yeah.
69:54allowing him to avoid trial for felony charges of a great aggravated battery with a deadly weapon, fleeing police, resisting arrests, stalking.
70:01Um, it's a horrible story. You can look it up.
70:05Uh, that happened in the off season with him and his girlfriend or ex-girlfriend.
70:09Um, but I don't think I'm aware of like what his, his status is, I mean, I hate even the way I went about addressing the story.
70:18I hate because like it's, it is really quite upsetting and it just is something that I don't think it's come up.
70:25Cause I haven't talked about the Falcons at all, but it is talking about Jalen Walker.
70:30And I think about, you know, he was the leading set.
70:33Well, he, I believe was leading sack getter, For the team last year.
70:37I will say not that this is completely separate from what I just said.
70:42And, and I hope it doesn't detract from the seriousness.
70:45I thought Jalen Walker was a better player. Um, yeah.
70:48And I'm more, I'm very, I am optimistic about him.
70:51I thought he, at times flashed a lot of the traits that I liked about him as a prospect at Georgia.
70:58Uh, the instincts, instincts, frankly, um, the athleticism, uh, the, uh, he's plays really, really hard, but yeah, I do wonder what's going to happen with Chris Jr.
71:07Do you have any idea? I'm not, I just Googling and I'm not seeing it.
71:12No, I don't think anything has, has come from the weekend.
71:15That's probably again, one thing that the league is probably going to wait until the last possible moment to, to actually say something about it.
71:23Well, it is another reason why Walker is actually important, really important for them.
71:27Uh, they did keep their defensive coordinator. Also Jeff Wilbrick in apart because I think he says, he's surprising.
71:33They finished 12th in DVO. This was kind of like a surprising unit.
71:38They had like really flashy big games. You remember the Rams game, right?
71:42Like certain teams, they, uh, they gave Drake may.
71:45Patriots fans drag me for saying that the Falcons defense gave Drake may a hard time, but they did.
71:51I'm not saying he was bad. I'm just saying it was a hard game.
71:55All right. Um, yeah, but it's a good pick.
71:58All right. Saints. So I went back and watched a little bit for this one.
72:03Um, I'm going to go with Kelvin banks jr.
72:06Who was last year, the rookie left tackle. And I thought of this while I was watching Tyler shock.
72:12Obviously we're not picking quarterbacks. Um, so when I think about the saints offense and what it would look like for them
72:19to take a step in year two, I really think this young offensive tackle duo, him and Fulong on the right side,
72:26if they continue building on what we saw in the end of last season, I actually think this could be a pretty good offensive line.
72:34They added David Edwards also from Buffalo. And when you think about that coupled with the addition of Tyson and what I
72:41saw on shuck, I start getting a little bit excited about this saints team.
72:45And I'll go back to banks jr. So again, played his best football in the second half of the season.
72:51Some of that was competition. Got, uh, Carolina twice, not the greatest pass rush, Miami, Tampa, the jets, the Titans.
72:58Yeah. Okay. However, I'll say watching him and I was watching him while watching shuck.
73:02There's a lot to like, I thought his athleticism, his like, he's got really nice light feet, uh, doesn't panic.
73:09Good play strength. Some of the runs too. He had some pretty nasty finishes, particularly against Carolina.
73:14Um, there was something there. And I think, again, you think about like this offense growing together.
73:20Like if he can take another step in year two, why can't this be, uh, first of all, why can't this team win the NFC South?
73:28I would absolutely like when I think about like going back to my original point of, you know, what is swinging a
73:35season, the same should be trying to win the NFC South.
73:38That is the success. Like, this is not like, let's just see what we got in the young quarterback.
73:44You saw it last year. He was pro ready.
73:47I'll get into him more later. This team should be in contention with the division.
73:52And if you can tell me that these offensive linemen and banks, Jr.
73:56Take another step. I genuinely think this, could be one of the sneaky fun offenses to watch.
74:01Lee what? Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. And they, they had like a sneaky fun off season, which is the first time we could
74:08say that for the saints, I think ever, um, because they, they didn't like overcommit to anything, which, which was really nice.
74:15And they allowed a lot of their dead money to finally clear and hit the books.
74:21And they didn't try to, you know, bring back a, uh, I had to Mario Davis or, or anything like that to
74:28where they were just kind of doubling down and tripling down on some of those veteran players.
74:33They let some of those guys have a, have a clean break and started to get some, some more youth.
74:39I, and I think that is, is going to be a lot of fun.
74:44Uh, this is another, you know, just jump the other side of the ball real quick.
74:49This was a defense that was 10th in EPA per play, uh, throughout the season.
74:54Like they, they had some fun things. A lot of that was through the bad half of the season, which doesn't always translate.
75:01It's be careful in like make thinking that that is something that is just automatically going to continue.
75:07You can play the NFC South again. So also, also helps.
75:10Uh, and I think there are a lot of things inside the structure of the offense.
75:15Like I think, uh, Kellen Moore did some very fun things that helped the offensive line.
75:20I do think, uh, signing David Edwards certainly helps that interior too.
75:24And I think that's going to help, uh, the entirety of the offensive line.
75:29I think they made some, some really smart moves.
75:31This is the most optimistic I've been about where the saints are going in.
75:36Like since Drew Brees was there. Totally. I, the whole time I was watching to shock.
75:41I was thinking like Jordan Tyson is such a good fit for this offense, this quarterback, Chris Olave.
75:47Like it makes, if you just watch, cause, uh, Shucks got this real willingness to throw a lot of the stuff that I think Tyson's really good at.
75:56Middle of the field, uh, intermediate. He, he, I know I just said, I'll talk about Tyler's later, but like it is,
76:03it is, it was, it was a fun rewatch because it, you could just tell he was so much more comfortable in
76:09the NFL than, you know, I mean, he should be, he's 25, but, uh, I don't know the whole, I was very pleasantly surprised by the whole operation.
76:18But then when I started focusing on banks, I was, cause I didn't really think about him too much during the season.
76:25I didn't really like, I don't know. I thought the saints offensive line, I'm not going to say they were good either,
76:32because I don't think that's accurate, but I do think he was trending in the right direction, particularly by the end of the year, banks, Jr.
76:41And Fulano, honestly. But so just, you know, if that continues, I think you feel pretty good about him in year two.
76:48And then you feel pretty good about this offensive line.
76:51All right. Final team. The Carolina Panthers. All right.
76:54And, uh, one of the guys that banks is going to have to block, Jalen Phillips.
76:59I thought you were going to pick Jalen Phillips.
77:02Yeah. Yeah. I it's, it's really hard to go anywhere else.
77:05I, I thought when looking at the Panthers, just because of actually after I was, like I said, I was watching the
77:12Panthers and I guess the saints that I was like, Ooh, they need bass rush.
77:17So yeah. Uh, yeah. So, uh, yeah. Panthers were 31st in pressure rate and, uh, there was not a lot of help that they, uh, could have.
77:25So Phillips had 31.2% of his team's pressures between the dolphins and the Eagles, but only 14.9% of his sacks, which is
77:32something that hung me up a little bit. last year, he was able to kind of get around the quarterback, not necessarily to the quarterback.
77:40I think we know that pressures matter a lot.
77:43Uh, and throughout his career, he has been someone who has finished more often than he did.
77:49Uh, last year, uh, even like when the Eagles though, was like extremely a low rate, uh, where like only 60 is
77:566.8% of his pressures turned into sacks, which was, you know, one of the lowest figures.
78:01It was 142nd among 175 defenders with at least 200 pass rushes, but that's not something I'm quite worried about, but he
78:08is going to have to be some guy that turns into, or turns those pressures into sacks in order for it to
78:15really matter on this Panthers defense and for him to be worth what they gave him.
78:20And I, I understand the contract, especially after losing out on Milton Williams last year, uh, where he was really the impact pass rusher.
78:27You could get on the market, uh, knowing that you just kind of had to pay whatever it was to, to make
78:34sure you got him because I don't think there was like a bigger need than like Panthers edge rusher, uh, throughout the league.
78:42So he's just someone that I think just has to be this major impact player.
78:46One for this defense to be good to, to make up this contract, which is like a very real three year contract
78:53with how the money is spread out. And some of the guarantees, uh, that go into all three seasons.
78:59So I think if he is not that guy, then I think that the Panthers still have some issues on defense.
79:06Yeah. Cause the rest of the defense, you feel like should be pretty solid actually, right?
79:11Like corner duos quite safety is the question. That's one where I don't know.
79:16I don't have it in front of me, but I remember looking at it recently, not feeling great.
79:21Um, but they did sign Devin Lloyd, uh, at a much cheaper deal than I thought he was going to get.
79:28It was fine. I was like, Oh yeah, I can't get that upset about this.
79:33I don't know. I, yeah, I thought he was going to get much more and I would have been like, Oh, I
79:40don't know about that, but at what they got him for, I think that makes a lot of sense in that defense too.
79:47Yeah. Um, and then of course on the inside you have Derek Brown and yeah, I, yeah.
79:52It's, and, and, and the, you know, the young pass rushers scoring Prince, like if Jalen is, top 10 pass rusher in
79:59the NFL, then you feel fine about the rest of the group, but he has to be top 10.
80:05It does seem on, on its, on its face to be a very good fit for Evero, right?
80:11Who comes from the big Fangio tree. And there's a reason why big Fangio and the Eagles wanted to keep Jalen Phillips by all accounts.
80:19And then they traded for a granite. Like there's a, it's a prototype, right?
80:24Of a complete edge. Phillips is a good run defender too.
80:27He, he, I feel like has become a little bit underrated in some people's estimation because of the lack of sack production.
80:34But when you watch the games, he's so clearly a top tier defensive lineman to me or top tier edge to me.
80:41So yeah, I, I, I, I understand like, what was it?
80:45It was 38 people at 30. I think it went mafia 20, Oh, way 25 Phillips 30 per year.
80:51If I remember correctly, I get it. It was a little bit surprising, but when you take a step back and look
80:58at the other options, like he is better than those players, right?
81:01It makes sense that he got more money. So, and then, yeah, you're like, okay, well, you know, like I said, okay, safety is Merrick and Scott.
81:10So, and then ransom. So, you know, it's, it's not that bad, but nickel, you kind of wish, but like, yeah, this,
81:17I think if Phillips is Phillips, if Phillips is, hits his ceiling, this, is at minimum an average defense, which is.
81:24A leap, you know, that's, that's a pretty significant improvement and you like everything on offense offense.
81:29I don't believe you for not picking offense. It's quarterback is just, you know, that's the X factor there.
81:35I, the rest of the offense looks pretty damn good to me.
81:39So, yeah, I like a lot of it, you know, Ted was really, it was incredible last year.
81:45I, you know, one of the many Jalen Coker fans.
81:48Um, I think like that is just something that, yeah, the, the offense I think is going to be structured fairly well.
81:55And yeah, since line should be way better, healthier, they threw a ton at the tackle position.
82:00So I, I feel really good about the decisions that this front office has made on offense.
82:06I like a lot of their choices. Honestly, I like the, the Dan Morgan era.
82:10I feel like, you know, they've got a big decision looming obviously with Bryce young, but otherwise when I look at everything
82:17else that they've done, I feel pretty solid about most of it.
82:21So, um, all right, that concludes our NFC X factors.
82:24Uh, Dan, where you mentioned you have an article coming out.
82:28You have the FTN chapters. Where can people find you find your work?
82:32Uh, yeah, we'll go mostly on blue sky. That's all going to be posted there, whatever it is.
82:38But, uh, yeah, uh, the big thing is the FTN football almanac for 2026 available for pre order.
82:43Now should be available for pre order. Now pre order.
82:47Now, uh, it should be out early July. I believe, I think there's a set date.
82:52I don't remember what it is. It's the top of my head.
82:55We're, we're on top of it. Um, as I, uh, am slightly behind on chapters I need to write.
83:01Um, but we are, yeah, it's, uh, I definitely the, the best thing to get you ready for the, this season.
83:08And, uh, you know, six chapters for me, a lot of things you're yes.
83:13You say that on the cover of the book.
83:15So, yeah. Uh, that's really funny. I didn't even know that.
83:19Um, yes, I seriously folks, I always recommend this, the FTN fantasy guide.
83:23You can get a digital copy or paper, right?
83:26So both FTP, it is by far, hands down the best preview that exists right now.
83:31Um, and it is really great for, if you're into fantasy as well, I think just like, is you good, a good
83:38oversight of everything, but I, I, I think it is invaluable for the league wide coverage.
83:43Some of the best writers around. It is awesome.
83:46so, and also you should check out FTN fantasy in general.
83:49I mean, you hear me always on the show mentioning stats that I use, uh, from the site.
83:55It is really, really useful in that regard. So FTN fantasy, go check it out.
84:00Uh, go follow Dan wherever you are, but especially on blue sky.
84:04Um, and I will be back next week to do the top 10 offenses of 2026.
84:09I already have no idea who I'm going to pick for number one.
84:13That's not true. I think I know you'll have to tune in to find out.
84:18Um, and if you are watching love Island, uh, we are now recapping the show on viewer discretion, David Dennis, Jr.
84:24And I lot hat, we did our first recap of the premiere next one.
84:29We'll drop on Thursday morning. A lot has already happened.
84:32You watched, you watched love. I think you do.
84:35Yes. So you, you convinced me to switch over to us last year.
84:39Cause I was a UK. Oh, I'm sorry. Yeah.
84:42Yeah. I'm still a little mad at you for that, but, I'm behind, uh, I'm behind on us this year.
84:48Uh, but we are, uh, we're, we're getting into it.
84:51So I'll be caught up soon. Okay. Just Google this who the new bombshell.
84:56His name is Corbin. If you're listening at home, if you don't watch love Island, just Google Corbin bombshell, Dan.
85:02And I want you to tell me if this is not Kyle Hamilton's complete doppel hanger.
85:07He is. He came in, I think on Saturday night or something.
85:11He even sounds like him when he talks. It's so uncanny.
85:15He's also right. Yeah. He also is like, he's just like, I'm six to four.
85:19And my brain's like, that's Kyle Hamilton. Like I, because of course that's like how I think, but, um, it is crazy
85:26how much he looks like Kyle Hamilton. So yeah.
85:29Anyways, uh, go check that out. All right. Uh, thank you as always to the folks at home, Omaha productions who make
85:36this podcast, Owen Saylor, Tucker Tashen, Kirsten Sobecki, Jack Foster, that in a different order this week.
85:42And now my brain's all confobulated. Uh, and otherwise I'll see you next week.
85:46Top 10 offenses. Let's go. You can't reason with the sun.
85:49Trust us. We've tried this summer. It's time to put that angry ball of fire on mute.
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