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Dynasty Underground - ADPs to TARGET and FADE in Dynasty Startup Drafts!

STACKED extracted the fantasy-relevant player signal from this podcast and kept the full transcript here for context.

1 hr 37 min
Duration
Estimated from transcript
Jun 20, 2026
Published
Sat, June 20, 2026
76
Player insights
52
Players mentioned
Topics
Colston LovelandMakai LemonParker WashingtonBrian Thomas Jr.Christian WatsonDeVonta SmithMalik WillisOronde GadsdenC.J. StroudD.J. MooreRome OdunzeA.J. BrownBijan RobinsonBo Nix
Player analysis

Player insights

76

A.J. Brown

PositiveValue0:34

Going at 509 in fifth-round startups, analyst believes you'll get better than 509 production for the next couple of years from him in a win-now build.

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Bijan Robinson

PositiveProjection0:54

Robinson could easily be a third-round pick in startups next year and should be in the Chase Brown range at the very least, given his big playability in the Falcons offense at his age.

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Bo Nix

PositiveValue0:11

Bo Nix is available at ADP 401 (or 311 as of May 1st), representing significant value as a late-round quarterback option with rushing upside, though the analyst is not a huge fan of the player.

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Brian Thomas Jr.

NegativeProjection0:07

Brian Thomas Jr. was the biggest faller in year-over-year ADP movement, representing a significant decline from his previous valuation in dynasty startup drafts.

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PositiveValue0:49

Thomas was a huge fade last offseason but the hate may have gone too far; his true value probably lies somewhere in between and he should be valued in the late fourth to early fifth round range.

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PositiveRole32:37

Thomas is a freak athlete and the 'prince that was promised' on Jacksonville's offense, but faces target competition from Parker Washington, Jacoby Myers, and Travis Hunter.

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Brock Bowers

PositiveProjection0:18

Brock Bowers is the odds-on favorite to be the tight end one in redraft 2026, though Colston Loveland is positioned as a strong alternative if given odds.

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Bucky Irving

NegativeBust0:35

Fifth-round running back who analyst is fading and would not draft at this ADP.

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C.J. Stroud

PositiveValue0:37

Quarterback available in the eighth round who analyst successfully drafted and prefers over taking Fernando Mendoza early. Better value than drafting a rookie pick in the third round.

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PositiveValue31:54

Stroud is someone the analyst would be happy to catch the falling knife with in the eighth round, representing good value at that stage.

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Caleb Williams

PositiveProjection0:32

Analyst has Caleb Williams as his quarterback 3 in dynasty, indicating strong confidence in his long-term value despite being ahead of his ADP.

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Cam Ward

PositiveProjection0:57

Ward can be a strong quarterback producer and is expected to throw for 4,000 yards and reach near 30 touchdowns; he has less risk of losing his starting job in 2026 compared to Shuck and represents better stability.

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Carnell Tate

NegativeValue0:30

Wide receiver 15 going at 408 in startups, but analyst prefers Luther Burden over him, having Burden ahead by a couple spots. The archetype difference (X receiver vs. slot flanker) favors Burden in PPR leagues.

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Chase Brown

NegativeBust0:26

26-year-old running back without draft capital who is a sell in the fourth round when compared to Kenneth Walker, Breece Hall, and Travion Henderson, all of whom have longer runways despite Brown's strong redraft value.

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Chris Olave

PositiveValue0:33

Wide receiver 13 who analyst would have ahead of George Pickens despite concussion concerns. Analyst notes he had a better collegiate profile and has proven to be a consistent performer.

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Christian Watson

PositiveBreakout28:28

Watson has massive upside with top-10 wide receiver production potential if healthy; in the last 10 weeks of 2025, he was 14th in receiving yards, 8th in yards per route run, 5th in touchdowns, 3rd in deep targets, and 5th in fantasy points per route run (0.58).

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PositiveInjury29:00

Watson's main risk is injury, which is a significant concern that keeps him from being drafted higher despite his upside potential.

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PositiveValue30:08

Watson's current ADP is around wide receiver 34-36 in the back of the eighth round, but his recent production suggests he could be valued in the 20s based on upside alone.

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Chuba Hubbard

PositiveValue30:56

Hubbard is an absolute afterthought for fantasy gamers but could have a decent year in dynasty; Jonathan Brooks is no sure thing and Rico Dowdle is no longer in the picture, making Hubbard the workhorse.

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Colston Loveland

PositiveBreakout0:13

Colston Loveland is the analyst's top tight end target in dynasty startups, positioned as either the first or second option in Chicago's offense with significant upside potential.

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PositiveRole0:15

Colston Loveland is the safest of the three Bears assets (Loveland, Rome, Burden) and is being deployed in ways that will take his route tree to the next level according to Ben Johnson.

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PositiveProjection0:18

Colston Loveland could easily be the tight end one in redraft in 2026, with the analyst believing he's a very good bet for that outcome and willing to take him at odds against Brock Bowers.

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PositiveValue0:18

Colston Loveland is currently at ADP 305 (as of May 1st) with a 74% chance of being available at pick 301, representing strong value for a tight end with elite upside potential.

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PositiveProjection0:19

Colston Loveland's ADP is spiking upward significantly, moving from late second round territory and showing parabolic growth in value as of June 4th.

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PositiveProjection0:32

Analyst has Colston Loveland as his tight end 2 in dynasty, indicating strong confidence in his long-term value as a Bears pass-catcher.

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D.J. Moore

PositiveDepth Chart0:14

DJ Moore is gone from the Bears, creating a consolidated target share opportunity for remaining receivers like Colston Loveland.

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PositiveValue0:40

Analyst traded for DJ Moore, noting that many people are down on him and he's been difficult to sell for years. Represents a value opportunity when someone is willing to trade for him.

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Dalton Kincaid

PositiveValue35:41

Kincaid is easy money at tight end 12 ADP (around 9-11 overall); he was super efficient per route run and just needs 70% snap share to have viability as a trusted Josh Allen target.

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DeVonta Smith

NegativeValue0:42

Sixth-round receiver who also benefited from A.J. Brown's departure but analyst gives the edge to rookie Makai Lemon due to age and the fact that Smith hasn't beaten out another alpha in his own offense.

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PositiveRole0:43

Smith has not beaten out another alpha in his own offense for years; while the Eagles have faith in him, Makai Lemon as a rookie may be positioned to soak up more targets and play a more prominent role.

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NegativeUsage0:46

Smith has received too few targets over the last couple of seasons to reach the heights desired for a player of his caliber, though the Eagles' offensive coordinator change and new personnel may improve the situation.

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Drake Maye

PositiveProjection0:06

Drake May has risen dramatically in dynasty startup ADP, moving from QB5 last year to QB2 this year, representing one of the biggest year-over-year risers on the OTC tool.

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Fernando Mendoza

NegativeBust0:35

Quarterback 15 at 506 ADP who analyst would rather wait on. Going too early when quarterbacks like Jordan Love (510) and Jared Goff (703) are available later. Likely to fall below this ADP next year.

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Garrett Wilson

PositiveValue0:26

25-year-old wide receiver who has dominated targets since entering the NFL despite playing with poor quarterbacks. Analyst recommends buying him as a fourth-round value.

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George Pickens

NegativeBust0:33

Wide receiver 10 at 510 ADP who analyst would rather fade in favor of younger receivers like Luther Burden and Chris Olave. On a franchise tag with uncertainty about his future with the Cowboys beyond 2027.

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Harold Fannin

PositiveProjection0:08

Harold Fannin is the number five riser in year-over-year ADP movement, showing significant value appreciation in dynasty startup drafts.

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Jadarian Price

NegativeBust0:01

Price is a first-round running back that is not a great value; he was barely a first-round running back on a team known for benching first-round running backs in favor of more productive undrafted players.

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Jameson Williams

PositiveValue0:50

Williams is going at wide receiver 28 and represents value; despite dunking on drafters two straight years with infuriating goose eggs, he has finished as a top-15 wide receiver and is worth targeting in this range.

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Jared Goff

PositiveProjection0:36

Quarterback going at 703 ADP, nearly two full rounds after Fernando Mendoza and Jordan Love, illustrating the gap in quarterback valuations.

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Javonte Williams

NegativeBust0:49

Williams' wheels could fall off at any point, not necessarily due to injury but potentially because the Cowboys may try out other players in his role.

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Jaylen Waddle

PositiveValue0:52

Waddle at wide receiver 29 is an absolute steal and represents the line of demarcation for young stud wide receivers; he is a clear wide receiver one for his own team and still relatively young.

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Jeremiyah Love

PositiveValue0:09

Jeremiah Love is going at RB4 (ADP 206), five picks after Ashton Gentry, representing potential value in the running back position.

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Joe Burrow

PositiveProjection0:06

Joe Burrow is highlighted as having a historically high and consistently high touchdown rate, making him one of the few elite quarterbacks worth considering in early rounds of dynasty startups.

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Jordan Love

PositiveProjection0:36

Quarterback going at 510 ADP, four picks after Fernando Mendoza. Analyst notes the significant gap in quarterback ADP between Mendoza and Love.

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Kenneth Walker III

NegativeBust0:28

25-year-old running back who is a sell in the fourth round because he's at peak value and the downside from missing time is glaring.

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Kenyon Sadiq

NegativeBust0:01

Sadiq is a sell; there is a tight end going much later than tight end 9 that is more desirable than Sadiq at his current ADP.

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Kyler Murray

NegativeValue0:01

Murray is a sell in the seventh round; he should be traded away if someone wants to acquire him at that price.

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Luther Burden

PositiveSleeper0:28

Fifth-round value who analyst believes belongs in the third or fourth round. As of June 4th, his ADP is around 409 and climbing. Analyst fired on him in multiple startups in the fourth round and had him as a top-12 dynasty wide receiver.

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Makai Lemon

PositiveValue0:42

Sixth-round pick (604) who is the obvious value to rise out of this tier following A.J. Brown's departure. Now likely going in the fifth round at the latest as of June 4th.

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PositiveValue0:43

Lemon has fallen from mid-fourth round ADP (408-404) in early April to late sixth round after the NFL draft due to landing spot hate, but this is a historic overreaction; with AJ Brown now traded, his value should sharply increase and represents a major target opportunity in every startup.

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PositiveBreakout0:44

Lemon earned targets at a ridiculous rate and is positioned to soak up targets in the Eagles offense; he is expected to be a third-round prospect next year, similar to Mecca Buka's trajectory.

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PositiveProjection0:45

Lemon is expected to see a sharp increase in value following the AJ Brown trade, which has not yet been priced into his ADP due to anchoring bias and timing of the trade announcement.

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Malik Willis

PositiveBreakout37:26

Willis is an asymmetrical upside bet in the ninth round with rushing floor combined with passing efficiency; if he hits, he could be a top-7 quarterback with rushing upside.

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NegativeRole38:32

Willis faces significant uncertainty with Miami's weak offensive weapons (Dulcich, Malik Washington) and potential team tanking, plus the risk of being benched despite good performance.

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PositiveValue39:59

Willis is valued at QB 26 prices but could produce as a QB 10 by production, making him a high-upside gamble in the ninth round.

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Michael Wilson

NegativeBust30:48

Wilson and Watson are the same bet, and objectively they are bad bets based on what was seen last season; there is some 'tuxedo risk' with Wilson.

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Nico Collins

NegativeValue0:32

Analyst would take Luther Burden ahead of Nico Collins in redraft leagues, weighing Burden's potential upside against Collins' likely 1,200+ yards and 10 touchdowns.

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Oronde Gadsden

PositiveValue0:01

Gadsden at tight end 10 in the eighth round is incredible value; both analysts have him comfortably in their top seven tight ends and would smash him at this ADP.

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PositiveProjection0:01

Gadsden's ADP has been dropping due to concerns about David Njoku, but this is wrong; Gadsden can put Njoku in the passenger seat just as Harold Fannin did, and he is producing 160-yard games as a rookie tight end.

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PositiveRole0:01

Gadsden has a better play caller than Harold Fannin had last year and plays in an offense that emphasizes mismatches; with Lad McConkie adequate outside but awesome in slot, Gadsden will frequently get favorable matchups.

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Parker Washington

PositiveValue38:38

At 9-12 ADP, Washington offers value and is preferable to Ricky Pearsall; he has shown strong per-route production and reemerged as the focal point of Jacksonville's passing game down the stretch last season.

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NegativeBust38:58

Washington has a Travis Fulgham-like fizzle-out outcome in his range of possibilities; his OTC score of 58.69 is not good, placing him in the 'bad bet zone' rather than the 'maybe zone.'

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PositiveRole39:03

Washington is getting more diverse route tree opportunities and playing more outside, which are positive developments, but he faces competition from Brian Thomas Jr., Jacoby Myers, and Travis Hunter.

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PositiveProjection40:02

From week 9 onward last season, Washington was the wide receiver 17 in points per game with 14.2 PPG, demonstrating strong recent production.

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Patrick Mahomes

PositiveProjection0:05

Patrick Mahomes, formerly the QB1, now lives in the middle class of quarterbacks due to changes in how defenses have adjusted, making him less of a first-round priority.

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RJ Harvey

NegativeBust0:01

Harvey is a sell at RB 25; while Jadarian Price has temporary upside similar to what Harvey had last year, Harvey himself is overpriced at his current ADP.

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Rome Odunze

PositiveRole0:15

Rome Odunze is still on the outside looking in among the Bears' receiving options, not based on talent but on the type of routes he runs and how the team deploys him.

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PositiveValue0:33

Fifth-round pick (507) who analyst believes is worth a bet and sometimes falls in value. Analyst would be okay drafting all the Bears at value.

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Sam Darnold

PositiveValue32:01

Darnold is a quarterback the analyst is happy to acquire at his current price point, representing good value.

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Saquon Barkley

NegativeBust0:35

Fifth-round running back who analyst is fading entirely, along with Kyron, Bucky Irving, and Fernando Mendoza. Not interested in any of them at this ADP.

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Travis Hunter

PositiveRole33:27

Hunter is on Jacksonville's roster and part of the crowded receiving corps, with the team drafting two tight ends signaling more 12 and 13 personnel usage.

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Trayvon Henderson

PositiveValue0:27

23-year-old running back going behind Chase Brown, Kenneth Walker, and Christian McCaffrey who could see one of the biggest value spikes in the fourth round. Analyst would take him over all three of those backs.

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Trey McBride

PositiveProjection0:13

Trey McBride is described as a great pick in tight end premium leagues and will be very productive, though Colston Loveland is positioned as a superior long-term value.

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Troy Franklin

NegativeValue0:41

Analyst traded away Troy Franklin (along with 302 and 402) to acquire Basil Tootin and the 305, indicating preference for Tootin over Franklin.

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Tucker Kraft

PositiveValue0:34

Tight end 6 at 511 ADP who analyst has as tight end 5 behind Tyler Warren. Coming off injury but analyst believes he's being slept on and is at the level of Tyler Warren and Trey McBride if he gets proper usage.

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Wan'Dale Robinson

NegativeValue18:47

Robinson at 9-06 ADP is considered a little bit scary by the analyst.

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Full transcript

Episode Transcript

1,113
0:00Shuck has major, major tuxedo risk. Yes. Yes. He's prancing around in a tuxedo as we speak.
0:05No doubt. A shuxedo. A shuxedo. A shuxedo! Yeah, the entire Saints offense is cloaked in a shuxedo right now.
0:12We're not sure if it's a nice three piece or if it was bought at the thrift store yet, but time will tell.
0:19Sights and sounds and edges found. You will now get down with the Underground.
0:24Post it up on the OTC Fantasy YouTube channel and find all of our work at otcffb.com.
0:29Dynasty Underground is back in the crib. I am Trav, I'm Hostin and West Coastin boys.
0:34And since I'm West Coastin, I was thinking earlier, Spice One has a song, a gentleman called Strap on the Side.
0:41And in that song, he says, Rolling with my motherfucking strap on the side of me.
0:46Can't fuck with the East Bay G's. And sometimes guys, that's how I feel coming into this show, getting to podcast with absolute weapons, such as yourselves.
0:55Starting with the Miyagi, always letting the AK spray Mr.
0:58Jacks Falcone. How are you tonight, brother? I mean, you wonder why Trav is here.
1:02That was epic and beautiful. And I appreciate you.
1:05That was, I mean, just bars, just bars and fire.
1:09I mean, unspeakable, unbelievable. Well done, sir. Don't let him tell you I don't bring anything to the table boys.
1:15Don't let him tell you. And fittingly with our pre-show conversation, the pistol grip pump.
1:20Speaking of East Bay G's. Speaking of Strap-Off. In his now infamous pineapple shirt.
1:24One Joquavius Kubitakis. How are you tonight, brother? You're looking extra chipper.
1:28I mean, we talked about the shirt. I promised the people the shirt would be worn.
1:33Just this really nice Hawaiian shirt that means nothing at all, unless it does.
1:38And, you know, I was told to wear it if I want a threesome and I wanted to have one with you guys.
1:45Thanks, buddy. Yeah, that makes, I think, two out of the last three or four shows that I now have a weird boner.
1:52So thanks, Joe. Can I just say that maybe, just maybe, people are looking at you for other reasons, though?
1:59Can I just posit that? You know? Not just because it's a great shirt.
2:03Maybe. I don't know. I'm not, this is a, this is a question.
2:07I'm not, I'm not, no accusation here. Love you, buddy.
2:10My good looks? Is that what you're talking about?
2:13Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I'm just playing. I'm just playing.
2:16I did that for people. Yeah. It is a cool new melon hat.
2:20Melon, if you want to sponsor us. I'm not down with most sponsors.
2:24I actually hate almost all of them, but Melon, I will, I will sell the shit out of your hats if you send me some.
2:32Okay. All right. Not a speck of dust on it.
2:36Not a speck. Very good boys. Fun little intro there.
2:39Fun pre-show conversation as well. And a fun show we have on the docket.
2:43Of course we mentioned where everybody can find our work.
2:46Of course, subscribe to the YouTube channel. Weekly episodes of this show, you get episodes of undrafted.
2:52Curti's on the live streams and we've got other things coming to that YouTube channel as well.
2:57So make sure you subscribe. But on this very show boys, we're going to talk about kind of talked about a couple of different ways to frame it.
3:06We could talk about it like the little bit of misplaced ADPs in startups right now.
3:11We can talk a little bit about players who we think are going to see big value jumps come 2027 startup drafts.
3:18I think those things kind of coincide with each other and we're going to do it all using the OTC ADP tool at OTCFFB.com.
3:26So make sure you go check it out. The ADP that we're looking at tonight, boys, is from April 1st until today.
3:33So I think that's interesting because we have the NFL draft in there, which means that there's been some time for some
3:40of these rookies to be drafted in these startup drafts.
3:43And so curious to see how that shakes out as well.
3:47But boys, I want to talk about the first few rounds, because if we're thinking about guys that can jump in value,
3:54I think the first few rounds, these guys don't have a lot of room to necessarily jump in value if we're thinking
4:01they're jumping three rounds in ADP or something like that.
4:04Anything that jumps out to you as far as maybe strategies you'd be employing this year?
4:09Maybe some players that jump out to you that you'd be targeting in those rounds?
4:14I think what's interesting to me is the discourse about early quarterback has changed a little bit.
4:19I can remember in the last couple of years, two, three years, that in super flex leagues, you'd almost see a first round with eight to 10 quarterbacks.
4:28And I'm seeing that that's a not happening. And B, that the public sentiment thinks that's almost not that smart.
4:35They'll kind of poo-poo those ideas of taking Joe Burrow over B.
4:38John Robinson, which I'm not here to argue against it or for it.
4:43I've actually played a lot of late round quarterback in startups before.
4:46So I'm OK with that. I think you can usually find a lot of value in this particular case, though, the way
4:53that the ADP is shaping out quarterbacks are a different type of play here.
4:58What are your thoughts, Joe? Well, I think it's almost back to the way we played this game back in 2010, 2011.
5:05Like, you know, the rise of the late round quarterback.
5:08Shout out JJ. Yeah. Right. Where because of the way the macro view is this because of the way defenses have adjusted,
5:15it is harder to predict bankable, outrageous scoring from the quarterbacks.
5:19And what that does is create a much larger middle class.
5:22One that the former 101 for many years, Patrick Holmes, now lives in.
5:26Yep. Right. So this middle class is the guys that we've talked about in years past.
5:31Right. Where it's just like, all right, who gets hot on touchdown rate?
5:35Who has the forty five hundred plus yard season?
5:38Right. Those guys can come from anywhere from like, I don't know, QB eight to like QB 22.
5:44And they can kind of be interchangeable. And so what you're really doing is making probabilistic bets based on who is more
5:51likely to at least give you the floor that you want.
5:55And in the first round of a startup, you're not looking for floor.
5:59You're looking for a difference maker. And that's why I think we've seen so many of these QBs get pushed down in
6:06the ones that are near the top outside of like Joe Burrow, who has a historically high, consistently high touchdown rate.
6:12The rest of them all have this rushing upside, which gives them the floor ceiling combo that you want.
6:19Yeah. So I think that's generally what's what the shift has been more a macro thing about how defenses have adjusted and
6:26the middle class of quarterbacks has grown. What I'm looking for in the first round is like the mainstays, because we've got
6:33a few new entrants into the first round. Actually, one of the really cool tools on OTC is you can look at
6:40the current startup and you can look at year over year.
6:43You can toggle to year over year. And you can see the dudes that have jumped into the first round that weren't there necessarily before.
6:51Or one obvious one is Drake May, who Jackson and I has, you know, famously had as the QB, I don't know,
6:58five going into last year, which was one of our best calls ever.
7:02And now he's going at the 105. Yeah. It seems like the QB two.
7:07So I think that that's another cool tool to look at.
7:10But in general, it's a macro thing. And, you know, the premium on rushing is more important than ever.
7:16If you're going to be firing on a quarterback in that first round, the year over year tool is absolutely awesome.
7:23And of course, it does have Drake May as the number one year over year player from last year, this year.
7:30And of course, the biggest faller was my number one cell, which I said everywhere, which was Brian Thomas Jr.
7:36So just a little bit of a horn toot there for me.
7:40Let's see if I can unearth another one here today.
7:43I don't have as glaring a player as Brian Thomas Jr.
7:47was last year as a cell. I'll just say that.
7:50Yeah. And I was just going to piggyback off of what Joe said quickly there in that.
7:55Yes, this tool is phenomenal. Look at another call of ours.
7:59JSN is number two riser. Jackson Dart. Jackson Dart's the number three riser.
8:03Harold Fannin's the number five riser. It's just lovely.
8:06It's just it's beautiful. Yeah. Holy shit. We're pretty good at this.
8:09We're not bad at this, guys. We've yeah, not our first rodeo.
8:13So that's pretty nice results for the underground. And Joe, what I was going to say is to your point there, that
8:20middle class is a lot more rushing quarterbacks. So I think what we're seeing now is the pool of guys where we
8:27can see these breakouts coming is a lot bigger, too, for us to be taking those shots on, which creates more misses and more hits.
8:35But I think it's not like your twelve hundred yard quarterback rushers.
8:39We have a lot more of those four to eight hundred yard rushers, which I mean, that floor is amazing for those guys.
8:46I will I will just add, though, and this is important to think about in the entire context.
8:52Right. What's also happened with these two high shells that have completely changed and dominated the vernacular for the last three seasons
8:59is that the elite wide receivers have become more important.
9:02The elite running backs have become more important. And so we used to value quarterbacks, you know, way above receivers and running
9:09backs just because it was a math problem. Well, it's not so much the math problem isn't relative to position as much anymore.
9:17It's access to top tier players at the position.
9:20It's access to the elite players in the game of fantasy football, which we're solving for.
9:25And that could come from any position, including tight end, which is like the most abundant from a straight number standpoint.
9:31But Brock Bowers sure does make a big ass difference if you got him in a tight end premium league.
9:38Right. Yeah. Well said, gentlemen. Well said. Yeah, looking at some players here, I mean, you look at like Jeremiah Love going
9:45at 206, going as he is already going at the running back four, but going five picks after Ashton Gentry.
9:51Jackson Dart at 211. Jax, we're taking him at 211 easy, right?
9:55Yeah. I mean, that's the thing is like, you know, just like the Scott Fishbowl, which is coming up here shortly, you
10:02know, it's one of those things that actually signifies how different the masses can behave under the same conditions.
10:08Because you'll have 12 team leagues with, you know, just random people across the fantasy community.
10:13And there will be so much different behavior from each league.
10:17Some leagues will just snap up the quarterbacks so quickly.
10:20Others will fade them. It's really incredible. And I think the same thing can be true in your dynasty league.
10:26Of course, you know, the scoring will change these things.
10:29Of course, if there's a point per carry, you know, all these different things.
10:34Of course, I always say that, you know, so, so, so often check your, your settings and your scoring before you do a draft, of course.
10:42But if we're just talking, you know, uniform draft, you're still going to see tremendous difference from, from league economy to league economy.
10:50But in general, yeah, that's what I was so surprised at is that the quarterback seven, who is Jackson Dart, is going at the 211.
10:58I think in a lot of, a lot of instances, he's going much sooner than that in, in super flex startups.
11:04So, you know, look, I would love this way.
11:07This would be fantastic for me because I'd love to sort of, you know, push quarterback down and still get a guy
11:14like a Jackson Dart or, you know, someone with rushing upside, even a Bo Nix.
11:19I think Bo Nix, if I look, was at the 401.
11:22I'm not a huge Bo Nix fan, but 401, my goodness.
11:26I mean, I would be jumping up and down if, you know, if I could get my quarterback one is a Bo
11:33Nix in the fourth round when I already have three stud players.
11:37You know what I mean? Yeah. Yeah. So just as a point of reference, I just toggled with the settings and I
11:44just changed our date from April 1st to May 1st.
11:47And Jackson Dart moved up one spot. Bo Nix moved from the four, whatever you said, 401 to the 311, right?
11:54So you saw a slight uptick, I think, in most of the QB values after the NFL draft when probably drafters realized
12:01that this rookie class and all that. We should probably be focused a little bit more on the bankable assets.
12:07Yeah. Yeah. All right, boys. So early round strategy, we got a little bit there, some players picked out.
12:13But we're going to go to the fourth round and we're going to start our round by round look at some of these guys, boys.
12:21And so what I want us to do is we're going to look at the round and we're just going to be
12:28talking about some players that we think are good values in that round, maybe candidates for a big breakout.
12:34And we're going to do that right after this, gentlemen.
12:37We're back on Dynasty Underground, talking about some mispriced Dynasty startup ADPs as we will on the Dynasty Underground.
12:43How are we feeling, boys? Yeah, we're feeling good.
12:46Hey, before we get to the fourth round, though, I did have the take that is sort of bubbling over from last
12:53week that I wanted to mention at this particular point.
12:56Because, yes, because, you know, it's funny because our boy Keegan was in a draft tight end premium and he went ahead
13:03and drafted Trey McBride, which is a great pick.
13:06He's going to be very productive. And, of course, last week I mentioned that I think I want Colson Loveland as the tight end to in Dynasty.
13:15And that felt hot. It feels like a hot take.
13:18But what was interesting is Keegan went to make that trade because he was like, actually, that sounds pretty smart.
13:25Let me go ahead and do that. I'm going to trade my Trey McBride for his whoever drafted him, Colson Loveland, and
13:32just ask for a little bit of profit. And so the guy was like, nah.
13:36And then he was like, well, how about a little less profit?
13:40The guy was like, nah. And then he was like, how about straight up?
13:45And the guy was like, nah. So this actually happened in real time after the show.
13:50Keegan was like, tried to pull it off and couldn't do it.
13:54So I think the idea there is when you find that you're feeling a certain way, like I do about that position,
14:01would be that I'm just going to try and target Colson Loveland.
14:04The way that I'm going to try and target Colson Loveland in a startup is Brock Bowers is going to get drafted whenever he gets drafted.
14:13And whenever Trey McBride gets drafted at that very moment, obviously, I hope I have a pick right then and there or somewhere thereabouts.
14:20But if not, I'm looking to maybe maneuver my way into a position where I can get myself Colson Loveland at that point.
14:28I think it's very worth it. It's crazy because Trav probably just smiling ear to ear hearing me say this because this was his guy.
14:36But I really do believe that the way that this is all playing out, which, of course, hashtag Trav was right, said
14:43it would play out just this way that DJ Moore would be gone.
14:47And, of course, we'd have a consolidated target share.
14:50You're not the only one who said that, Trav, but certainly you were saying it.
14:54And loud and clear for everybody to hear, I think it's real.
14:58And I do think that actually Colson Loveland is either the first or second option in Chicago.
15:04I think it's probably Rome who's still a little bit on the outside looking in.
15:08Just not even based on talent, but just based upon the type of routes he runs and the type of way they deploy him.
15:16But the way that they deploy Colson Loveland, the way that Ben Johnson's talking about deploying him going forward, talk about those sweatpants getting a little tight.
15:25This is the stuff you want to hear. So I do believe that that's the way I'd play.
15:30And I am prioritizing Colson Loveland in the startup right now.
15:34Of the three Bears assets, Loveland, Rome, and Burden, Loveland is the safest asset for sure.
15:39And a tweet came out today, Joe. I'll get to you in just one sec.
15:44I see you're ready to pop off. Ben Johnson on Colson Loveland in an interview.
15:49I love what he brings to the table. He's one of the most consistent players I've been around.
15:54He's in early. He's always in his playbook. He's always taking notes.
15:58That's fucking lunch pail central right there. And the last quote, we're going to take his route tree to the next level.
16:05Bingo. That's what I love to hear. Explosion. Explosion.
16:08Joe? I was just going to point out the great irony that for Loveland to fly, Misa Dunze has to make a
16:15little bit of a hit at the same time.
16:18But to your point, Jack, I mean, perhaps one of the plays is just draft Loveland right after McBride goes off the board.
16:25The other play is if you're in the McBride spot, try and trade back to a few slots ahead of the Loveland spot.
16:33Make sure you got a backup plan. Right. But this is what we're always talking about, right?
16:38You want to be trading back. And what I found in the startups that I've done this year is it's hard to get those 27 firsts, right?
16:47It is hard to trade back out of the first round.
16:50But once the waterfall starts, right, once the dam breaks open a little bit and people start throwing first around, then like
16:57the arms race begins and other people start throwing first around too.
17:01So it's almost more difficult to get a first round pick trading back from the first round to like the third round
17:08this year, I've noticed, than it is from trading back from the second round to the third round after you let somebody
17:15else do the hard work for you. So moving back from McBride spot in the second round to the Loveland spot in, let's just say, early third.
17:24305 is his ADP right now. 305 is his ADP, but that's, I'm sure, climbing.
17:28So let's just say it's like the 301, right?
17:31But trade back, get a little something for it.
17:34And again, this is where the arbitrage takes place, right?
17:37Reading tomorrow's newspaper today, knowing where these values are going to be a year from now, and moving back to get Loveland
17:44at a price that McBride costs for a little bit of profit on top of it.
17:50That's how you make a difference on your team for years to come.
17:54Yeah, go to the OTCFFB ADP page. And I really believe studying that year over year will tell you a lot about
18:01just even just looking at this, the types of players in each column.
18:05You'll learn so much about what you should be doing.
18:08Move to where the puck is going. Right? Skate to where the puck is going to be.
18:13Hey! Hey, hockey. But, you know, that whole idea is, you know, so evident when you see the way that this is happening.
18:21I do think Loveland is a very good bet to be that type of player this year, who he could easily be
18:28the tight end one in redraft this year in 2026.
18:31I really believe it's in play. I mean, Bowers is the odds-on favorite.
18:35I would bet Bowers with even money. But if you give me odds, I'm happy to take Loveland.
18:41I think he's definitely right there. I just got a third round Bowers in a basketball draft today.
18:47Joe, I was stoked about it. Wow. I moved the dates to May 1st, so just within the last month, and he is still the 305 Colston Loveland.
18:56So capitalize on that. And this might not be, like, super valuable for the audio listeners, boys, but one cool thing about
19:03the site is that when you're in the ADP tool, you can drop each player down.
19:08You can see their ADP over time in a little bit of a chart there.
19:12You can see for Colston Loveland, let's just say at the 301, you got a 74% chance of getting Colston Loveland at
19:19the 301 in startup drafts right now. So if you're trading back to the 301, you got a pretty good chance.
19:26And if you go a little bit higher than that, then it's even better.
19:31So just another little advantage you can get there if you're cruising around on the OTC website.
19:36One of the coolest tools ever, by the way, is this thing that you just showed.
19:41But also, if you look at the Colston Loveland little graph, it's on a huge up.
19:46Yeah, totally. It's spiking. It's spiking huge right now.
19:49So it's like I know that last week, literally a week ago, I mean, I know I don't control ADPs, but certainly trying to see.
19:57I believe I was seeing this ADP happening in the future.
20:01Yeah, totally. That ADP, if you look at that chart, and that's why they're so useful side by side, right?
20:07We've got the pick availability matrix, which is so cool because you can basically see like if you take them at the
20:14basically 109, you got 100% chance of getting them.
20:17It's like 99% chance if you're anywhere through the 201, right?
20:20And it just drops progressively. But you compare that to the ADP over time where you can see that his value is
20:27going parabolic, and now he's probably a late second round pick.
20:31And like that's as of June 4th, which is five days ago at the time of this recording.
20:37So that's kind of the value that this tool brings is as you're getting ready for your drafts and you're looking at
20:44ADPs and values, you kind of know where the puck – we're showing you where the puck is going and telling you the probabilities.
20:51I can't think of a better tool when you're doing a startup.
20:55I'm actually really looking forward to – can we set up a startup right now?
21:00Let's do another listener league, right? Let's do another listener league.
21:03Ooh, damn. We've got our underground league. I think we need another underground league.
21:08I think one a year is a reasonable pace.
21:11Let's just throw it out there. Let's come up with some code for people to put, drop in the YouTube comments to maybe become a member.
21:19So, well, I don't know if I necessarily have anything right now.
21:23Do we think of it at the end? Does it have to be something that comes up organically on the show?
21:30Or do we say make sure you listen in next week because we're going to drop how you can get into this year's listener league?
21:37Pineapple emoji. What are you talking about? Pineapple emoji.
21:40Pineapple emoji is the right one. That's it. That is the right one.
21:45You can't beat it. Is there a pineapple emoji?
21:47Yes. I'm pretty sure. If you can put a pineapple emoji together, then you know that – we know that you're part of the plan.
21:55It would be great if it was a gorilla and a pineapple emoji.
21:59Yes. That would – I'm just seeing if there's a pineapple emoji.
22:03Yeah. Of course there's a pineapple emoji. I do think people get together online.
22:08Yeah. And they definitely agree. Now, if you give us an upside down pineapple in any way, shape, or form, then you
22:15can be the commissioner of this fucking league. I don't care.
22:18Yeah, you get the 101 at that point. Yeah, you're locked in, player.
22:22Yeah. Okay, so are we calling it now? You know, first nine other – Something like that, yeah.
22:28Pineapple emojis get into the listener league? Yeah, well, maybe eight.
22:32Should we let Keegan in this one? Oh, Keegan's got to get in this one too.
22:37Yeah. So, eight. We got eight. Whatever you're going to do, man.
22:41And you know I'm not going to look at any of that shit.
22:45So, it's up to you now. Okay. So, yeah.
22:48On the YouTube or on the podcast comments. Or Reddit or Blue Sky.
22:52Or Truth Mobile. If you're on Blue Sky, just put an upside down one for sure.
22:57Yeah. Yeah. So, do that. And when we see them, we got eight spots in the Dynasty Underground Listener League 2.0.
23:04Apparently, Joe. That was not something we talked about, but it's something that's happening.
23:08So good. You can't show me these sick tools and make me not want to draft.
23:13I'm sorry. I'm itching for a startup. I haven't done one since April.
23:17I'm going to hate this league. All these guys sniping my ass.
23:21Yeah. Wow. They're going to be sniping your ass with those upside down pineapples.
23:26That's for sure. I hurt coming out. Not that there's anything wrong with that.
23:30But what we're going to do, boys, is we're going to start going round by round.
23:35Starting with the fourth round. To get these value pockets and tell people who we think the best values are.
23:42The players who are going to jump the most.
23:44So, let's get into it here. The fourth round starts with Bo Nix at 401.
23:49Like you mentioned before, Jax. You got some Kenneth Walker.
23:52We got Travion in here. Rasheed still in the fourth round.
23:56Joe, why don't you give me your favorite value of the fourth round?
24:00I'm going to go ahead and say I'm just looking to see if he's even in the fourth round.
24:06Is Luther Burden of the fourth round? No, you don't get to say him yet.
24:11Brother, you're supposed to pull this up in front of you, my man.
24:15You don't get to say him yet. Oh, man.
24:18I'm taking Luther Burden in the fourth round. I told you I'm not.
24:22Where am I? Talk about where the fuck is going.
24:25All right. So, this is like easy stuff here.
24:28But no. You got to pick someone from the fourth, damn it.
24:32Yeah, yeah. All right. If we're going fourth round ADPs, I think I would have to go with Ladd McConkie.
24:38The reason I'm going Ladd is basically because we expect the Chargers to run a bit more 12 personnel with the addition of David Njoku this offseason.
24:47The fact that Keenan Allen, as of now, is not a Charger.
24:51And I don't think we think a ton about QJ on this here podcast, despite the spike weeks that he provides.
24:57And we love Trey Harris here, and we hope that he becomes the consistent wide receiver, too.
25:03But looking at that wide receiver room, the dude we think is going to be on the field in any formation that
25:10can play inside and outside is Ladd McConkie. You add Mike McDaniel to the mix, an increased play volume, and a dude that can scheme guys open.
25:18Ladd McConkie that can get open against anybody inside or out.
25:22He seems like one of the bigger beneficiaries of this regime change, of a healthy offensive line, of an increased play volume,
25:29and of the departure from Keenan Allen. We saw that sophomore slump from him as well, which probably scared some people off
25:36and made them think maybe the rookie year was a fugazi.
25:40But as you both know, he scored really well in our model.
25:43We've never stopped believing in the talent, and the stars are kind of aligning for him right now.
25:49So that's the obvious choice for me if we're talking about dudes that we're taking in the fourth.
25:55Although, again, I'd probably be taking Ladd at the end of the third.
25:59Yeah, I think that's probably about right for Ladd.
26:02Go ahead, Jack. Yeah, I was going to say Ladd as well, but I'm up in the air here looking at a bunch of guys.
26:10I mean, you know, honorable mention to Rashi Rice, who's falling right now because of off-the-field stuff.
26:15I think once he gets back on the field, he'll see a spike.
26:19Rashi, not a bad play. You know, Ladd McConkie, 24 years old.
26:23My player in this round is Garrett Wilson, who's 25 years old and has dominated targets since he's been in the NFL.
26:30He's been awesome earning targets. He's just been earning targets from really, really terrible quarterbacks by and large.
26:36He really has. I mean, what's the best quarterback he's played with to date?
26:40Hard to even come up with a name. I honestly challenge you to come up with who you think that might be.
26:47Aaron Rodgers for one play. Right. Aaron Rodgers. Yeah, exactly.
26:51That's the right answer somehow. My biggest sell on this list, and it's hard to sell any of these players because they're good.
26:58It's probably Chase Brown, 26-year-old running back without draft capital, although he's going to be awesome this year.
27:04So, you know, in running back world, I suppose you could do a lot worse.
27:08But, you know, when he's in a round with Kenneth Walker, 25 years old, Brees Hall, 25 years old, Travion Henderson, 23 years old.
27:16I just think all those other running backs have a little bit of a longer runway than Chase Brown does, even though
27:23I absolutely love Chase Brown and redraft. And certainly in 2026, I think he'll be just fine.
27:29So, really no big sells here, but, you know, let's definitely buy Garrett Wilson and Ladd McConkie for sure.
27:35Yeah, for sure. I was going to put Travion, maybe not necessarily as a mispriced ADP because I don't think it's necessarily
27:42that mispriced, but somebody who could see one of the biggest value spikes coming out of this for sure group, Travion Henderson.
27:49You see he's going behind Chase Brown. He's going behind Kenneth Walker.
27:52He's going behind Christian McCaffrey. I think I take him over all three of those guys.
27:58And then Kenneth Walker, I say, if you're throwing out a sell, I think Kenneth Walker could be a sell just because
28:05you're getting pretty peak value on him right now.
28:07And the downside by way of him missing time is pretty glaring.
28:11So, I can see capitalizing on that Kenneth Walker value as well.
28:15Yeah. Okay, moving into the fifth round, guys. Okay, Joe, you can hit it.
28:20You can hit it. Five. Bro, this was crazy.
28:22Five. I looked ahead because we were thinking about starting somewhere on the fifth round.
28:27I looked. I was like, wait, Luther Burden's in the fifth round?
28:31That doesn't even make any sense. I would have drafted him in the third or some shit.
28:36So, yeah. Go ahead, Joe. I mean, this one's like a layup.
28:40Well, I'm pulling up the chart on him right now because, again, this is from April 1st.
28:46I know that it's climbed since then. If you look at his as of June 4th ADP, it's about the 409.
28:52Right? Yeah. And it's also going parabolic relative to where it's been, which I guess is pretty consistently in the fifth round.
28:59I guess there's some uncertainty in terms of, like, who's going to be the Bears number one?
29:05How's the target you're going to shake out? And then maybe with, like, the Roma Dunze doom and gloom about his foot,
29:12it's risen as time has gone on this offseason.
29:15But, boy, I fired on him in a couple startups already in the fourth round and was very happy to do so.
29:22And, you know, we talked about this in startup season last year, right, where it's like you make a pick and everyone's just like, oh, damn it.
29:30That's the guy I wanted. And that's, like, the sign that you just put him on the block right away.
29:37Yeah. Or you just try and trade him right away.
29:40That happened with Luther Burden both times, right? Just, like, I'm taking him right now.
29:45And many people were lamenting the fact that Luther Burden was not available when they thought he'd be.
29:50So I think you probably need to be a little ahead of market on this one.
29:56Absolutely. That's because he belongs up there, right? Like, he straight up does.
30:00You know, I had the – it was funny because I just obviously was wrong about where the market was on Luther
30:07Burden because I went on Heath Cummings show and he was like, who's your number one sell?
30:12And I was like, oh, yeah, you know, Luther Burden or whatever.
30:16And he's like, that's my number one buy. And then I looked and we had them both at, like, wide receiver 12 or something.
30:24You know, I was like, well, wait a minute.
30:27I thought, you know, he's not wide receiver 12.
30:29This is, like, that price point puts him at, like, wide receiver 18.
30:34You know, but, yeah, I'm definitely ahead of market on that.
30:37I want to see him, you know, at least, you know, in that, you know, what you call it, Lad McConkie range ahead of that.
30:45I mean, yeah, definitely in that range. I mean, I don't know.
30:49I'm completely – All right. So, question. Carnell Tate.
30:52Carnell Tate is the wide receiver 15 going 408 in startups this offseason.
30:56Who would you rather have, Carnell Tate or Luther Burden?
30:59I'd rather have Luther Burden. I think it's pretty close for me.
31:03It's a pretty close one for me. I think I have Burden ahead by a couple spots.
31:08I have Burden ahead by a couple spots. I was going to say that, like, we talked about this, I think, last episode or maybe the one before.
31:17Joe, you mentioned you were super high on Burden having him in your top 10, which I don't think is egregious by any means.
31:25Jackson and I both had him, like, right in that top 15 area.
31:29So, I think what we're all saying kind of aligns to an extent, right?
31:33Well, no. Like, for Carnell Tate and Luther Burden, it's the archetype question, right?
31:38It's like X receiver versus a, you know, slot flanker hybrid that's going to get the layups.
31:43You know, the Queen Chesapeake versus the – what we think is going to be primarily an X receiver.
31:49Like, obviously, real-life value and fantasy value are different things.
31:53But to me, Luther Burden is clearly the better bet in fantasy football in a PPR league.
31:58Yeah. What about Nico Collins or Luther Burden? I did this.
32:02Luther Burden. Yeah. That's weighing – that's really close, too, because you're weighing the next couple years of, you know, probably 1,200
32:09plus and maybe 10 touchdowns for Nico Collins versus the potential upside of Luther Burden.
32:13I would probably take Luther Burden pretty close to, if not ahead of, Nico Collins in a redraft league.
32:19I've got him. You think so? I've got him.
32:22Interesting. Yeah, man. I think – I don't – I mean, Nico's great, but, I mean, I don't know, man.
32:29I think Luther Burden could have a big year.
32:32I really do. I think it's going to be really, really strong.
32:35And, you know, what's funny is I, you know, just draft all the Bears.
32:40I'm ahead of their ADP. I'm no Bears fan, but I've got, like, you know, Caleb as my quarterback three in Dynasty.
32:47I've got, you know, Loveland as my tight end two.
32:50I think, you know, I think Burden is a top 12 Dynasty asset at the wide receiver position, if not close to.
32:57And then even Adunze is worth a bet. You know, I think he sometimes falls sometimes.
33:02I mean, here he's also in this fifth round at the 507.
33:06I would be okay just sort of drafting all the Bears, you know, at value for sure.
33:11I'd take all of them. Well, like, in startup ADP, right, George Pickens is sitting here at the wide receiver 10.
33:18Yeah. I'd rather have a mechanic book over George Pickens who's going right after him.
33:23And then right after that is where I've got Luther Burden.
33:26Yeah. And I would have Chris Olave, who's the wide receiver 13, ahead of George Pickens as well because George Pickens, right, what do we know?
33:35He's on a franchise tag. He is, you know, kind of a wild card.
33:39Mercurial. That's a great word. Thank you. That is good.
33:42Look at that book. And he may not be on the Cowboys in 2027, not to mention, obviously, the age difference between
33:49him and these younger dudes that don't have as many question marks.
33:53I guess you can raise questions about Olave's long-term viability because of the concussion thing.
33:58But, boy, they're going to be running a lot of plays in New England, just like they – excuse me, in New
34:05Orleans, just like they will be in Dallas. And, you know, one broke out at a younger age, had a better collegiate
34:12profile, and, you know, has proven to be a consistent performer, whereas Pickens kind of caught lightning in the ball.
34:18And I love Pickens. He was one of our best last year.
34:22But, boy, I'd have him behind a lot of the dudes that are going after him.
34:27Yeah, interesting to play out. Like we continue to say, the Bears' offense is going to be the most interesting to watch in the entire season.
34:36Yeah, Rome at 507, I think it's criminal. I would absolutely be taking that.
34:40I think A.J. Brown, like, if you're doing a win-now build at the 509, I think you're going to get better than
34:47509 production for the next couple of years from A.J.
34:50Brown. So, depending on what you've done before the fifth round, I don't hear.
34:55I mean, how can we not throw out T.K.
34:58Kraft at the 5'11 going as the tight end six boys?
35:01Yeah. I have him as my tight end five behind Tyler Warren.
35:05And I think he is being slept on a little bit coming off of the injury.
35:10And I think people are going to get a mega value on Tucker Kraft because he is that player of a Tyler
35:17Warren, of a, like, Trey McBride level, I think.
35:20If he gets the amount of targets in the usage, I don't know if that level, like, Trey McBride levels comes into
35:27play for Tucker Kraft in the Green Bay offense.
35:30But I think we got a top five tight end on our hands for sure.
35:35I don't know about you guys, but I got a bunch of cells in this round, too.
35:40I mean, like, a bunch of cells. Bunch of players I wouldn't even think about drafting at this ADP.
35:46I don't know. Kyron. Yeah. Kyron sticks out like a sore thumb.
35:50Saquon, Bucky Irving, Fernando Mendoza, like, just all passes for me.
35:53I would just not be interested in any of them at this price.
35:58Yeah. I think they all have a value. But, like, when I look down the board a little bit and I see
36:05some of the names that are there, I mean, unless it's some kind of weird scoring, again, I'm absolutely fading all those
36:12types of players for players further down the board for sure.
36:15Okay. So, look at this. I want to look at that Mendoza thing because that's interesting.
36:20Quarterback 15 at the 506. Sure, he's young. Sure, he's a 101.
36:24But the next quarterback after him is Jordan Love at the 510, four picks later.
36:29And then it goes all the way to the 703 for Jared Goff.
36:33So, almost two more rounds between Fernando Mendoza and then the quarterback, two quarterbacks after him.
36:38Then there's a bit of a run of your Bakers, your Wards, your Shucks, your CJ Strouds, Darnold Murray as you get into eighth round.
36:46And we're going to get there, obviously. But I think I would rather just wait on that quarterback kind of like you
36:53guys were saying at the top of it. For sure.
36:56Yeah. Speaking of reading tomorrow's newspaper today, right? The guys you just mentioned, that neighborhood is where Mendoza is going to live next year.
37:04Right? So, he's going to... Yeah. Well, unless he's...
37:07He's going to fall below the Mendoza line. Right, right.
37:10But the only way he really goes up is if he smashes, which I suppose is possible, but not likely that he smashes.
37:17You know, I look at like a Jordan Love and actually the one you mentioned who I'm surely going to mention later is CJ Stroud.
37:25But like that's actually who he... If he's somewhere between Jordan Love and CJ Stroud, that's a huge win.
37:31And you have to draft him ahead of either of those guys who already exist.
37:36That's exactly the problem I ran into where I, in one of my startups, I drafted CJ Stroud.
37:42I got him in like the eighth round. And I was like, this is stupid.
37:47Yeah. And it's so funny because that was before the NFL draft.
37:50Yeah. So, I had drafted the 102 as one of my...
37:54Yeah, I drafted a rookie pick in place of a player at the end of the third round.
38:00Right. It's just there. I was like, I'm going to take the 102 here.
38:04Worst case scenario, it's Mendoza. Right. And then the, you know, sixth, seventh round came around and like, you know, CJ Stroud's still there.
38:12And then I finally just drafted CJ Stroud in the eighth round.
38:16I was like, well, why the hell would I use this pick on Mendoza?
38:20Right. Now I have to pick a wide receiver with this or I need to trade it.
38:25Right. But it gave me the flexibility to push it on quarterback.
38:29This is the benefit of doing pre-NFL draft startups.
38:32You get flexibility in these rookie picks, but it ended up being not the best value because I ended up taking a
38:39wide receiver whose ADP was lower than, you know, the late third round anyway.
38:44Yeah. And this is kind of like the thing that pops into my mind was why I was saying every single one
38:51of the picks you're going to make in your rookie draft is worth less than it normally is.
38:56And so you should be trying to trade it for one of those exact same things in a future draft.
39:03And that's the 102 right there. When would the 102 be that sort of blah, right?
39:08Like there's, it never happens. Even if we're wrong, there was someone you were at least excited about drafting at that 102 pretty much in every single draft.
39:17So yeah, not, not this year, sir. Of course we see quinch on there at the 502 Tyson at the 512 Jordan Tyson, of course.
39:25Speaking of actually getting out of those, those one or 26 first jacks, I made a trade this week.
39:31Just wanted to share with you guys, of course, felt like you might be a little bit proud.
39:37I needed a wide receiver. It's a team where I have a pretty strong young running back group.
39:42And I traded my 108 for DJ Moore and the 305.
39:46So I got myself a good wide receiver who has a chance at being a strong asset in my win bid.
39:53And I got out of that back half of the first round.
39:56So I was pretty stoked about that. I just traded for DJ Moore today as well.
40:01And Fuchs, Derek Fuchs was not happy about it.
40:04He's in the league. And he was like, how do you do this every single fucking time?
40:10I traded, uh, DJ, I received DJ Moore and gave up, uh, Patrick Bryant, Isaiah Bond and a 28 second.
40:16Wow. That's cooler than mine. Yeah. I was very excited about that.
40:20Oh, I hear you got rid of the roster cloggers in the process.
40:24Yes. Totally. Yeah. The Trojan horse roster cloggers. Who's like, well, Patrick Bryant could be somebody.
40:29Yeah. And you got two years to recoup that second, which is no problem.
40:34Oh, too. That's very nice. Yeah. I think he's probably worth somewhere around a second, which actually is not a crazy trade.
40:41It's not like, oh my God, I ripped him off or whatever.
40:44He's worth about a second, but it is a 28 second, not a 27 second.
40:49And it's also like that one Oh eight we've sort of said is like worth like maybe an early second.
40:56Yeah. Two Oh one, two Oh two. So it's not like they're that far off, but yeah, to be able to get
41:03them on the low side of that value is even better.
41:06But I do like the bet on DJ more if you can, if you can get them right now, because I think
41:13a lot of people are down on them. I haven't been in other leagues where I haven't been able to sell them literally for years.
41:21I've been trying to like get off DJ more.
41:24Nobody wants to pay anything for DJ more. So, you know, when someone comes a call and for players that you normally
41:31can't even get rid of, sometimes you can quote unquote, steal them a little bit.
41:36And that's what happened. I need to give Travis shout out because in that same league, I was picking at the one
41:4311 and once he identified this guy as the Mark, I, uh, I, I, I smelled blood and I traded the one
41:5011 Troy Franklin, the three Oh two and the four Oh two for facial tootin and the three Oh five.
41:56Yeah. So I just moved back in the third.
41:59I picked up tootin for the one 11, which I kind of feel like I did pretty good on that one too,
42:06but like God bless child for pointing out to me, uh, via trade that, uh, I need to go focus my attention on this guy.
42:14I think that's a great trade. The basial tootin trade.
42:17Yeah. Another basial share. I saw you, I saw you pimping your basial ownership percentages, Joe, and I went and looked at mine too.
42:25And I have 36%. So you win. Wow. I'm now over 50%.
42:29I'm now over 50% since I tweeted that. Well done.
42:32Let's look at this sixth round here, guys. These are the rounds where you can kind of make your money, right?
42:39You get these guys who are six round picks now who turn into third round picks next year.
42:44You're laughing. You are absolutely laughing in your dynasty leagues.
42:48I'm seeing some, something interesting right off the hop.
42:50Kai lemon going at 604 over Devante Smith with Smith having the better short-term production profile.
42:56Makai lemon, obviously having a few years of age on his side.
42:59What do you think about that contrast with those guys going in the same round?
43:04Joe. Well, before I knew you were going to ask that question, I had already had lemon teed up as the obvious
43:11guy that's going to rise out of this tier.
43:14This is again, based on April 1st to today.
43:17And now that AJ Brown is officially gone, I don't think you can get Makai lemon in the sixth round anymore.
43:24I'm guessing you have to fire on him in the fifth round at the latest.
43:28And that's probably about where he's going to live in startups for the rest of the off season.
43:34So I'm sorry, you were comparing Makai lemon to Devante Smith, who also benefited from AJ Brown's departure.
43:40I think the edge has to go to the rookie and the age and the fact that we've seen Devante Smith not
43:47beat out another alpha in his own offense for a number of years.
43:51And sure, they've got tons of faith in him, but I don't know, is Makai lemon going to be that new dude
43:58that just soaks up targets and they make Devante Smith kind of play something of a similar role.
44:04Uh, I would take if even money, I'm taking lemon.
44:07This is a, you can look at this ADP chart, ADP over time.
44:11Uh, you know, uh, Makai lemon peaked at the four Oh eight, four Oh four, something like that.
44:17Uh, at some point early in the, in April.
44:20Uh, so he was going in the mid fourth round and then before the NFL draft.
44:25And then on April 28th, we see a sharp, uh, decline in his ADP.
44:29And I'm just trying to rack my brain. What happened on April 28th?
44:33If I could just anybody, it's buddy. Yeah. Put my finger on it.
44:38Yeah. Can't even, you got a call from another team that didn't end up taking him.
44:43Right. Oh, right. Yeah. The draft. So people hate his landing spot, which is a historic lesson to not do that, to
44:50take advantage of that, because that's usually wrong. Now, of course we could be wrong on him as a prospect or as a player.
44:57Sure. That's possible too. But if we just say, let's bet against the masses, hating a landing spot, that's usually a good
45:04thing to do is to just bet against that.
45:07The masses in that way. He fell as far as like the 612, um, at one point.
45:13So yeah, I mean, to go all the way from the, basically the mid fourth to the late sixth is fading way too far.
45:20I think this is the, a Mecca, a Buka, um, you know, spot for me.
45:25I'm targeting Makai Lemon in every single startup. I'm going to take him ahead of ADP and I'm going to make it
45:32a priority ad in every single startup. I do.
45:35And I think I'm going to get a Mecca, a Buka type of return where he's a, as you pointed out, third
45:42round prospect, uh, next year, just like a Buka is today.
45:46Yeah. And you know, what you basically just described is before the NFL draft, the evaluation had him as something of a
45:53mid fourth to mid fifth round pick. Then the draft happens, everybody hits the landing spot, sharp decline into the sixth, uh, and even late sixth.
46:01And now AJ Brown has been traded and it's like, that has not actually been priced in yet.
46:07Right. Right. So, uh, he should see a sharp increase in value and is maybe there's just like, I don't know, um, anchoring bias tied to him.
46:15And, you know, the weird, uh, interviews and whatnot that people are also anchoring to, but this is a huge mistake.
46:22And one we're going to profit from greatly. We've been banging the drum all off season.
46:27And we don't, we don't love the offense for wide receivers, Joe.
46:31Right. I mean, there's still that, you know, we talked about, you know, I think the, the lack of targets for Devante
46:38Smith and AJ Brown over the last couple of seasons, which have just been too few to actually get them to where
46:45we would love the heights that we would love to get them to.
46:49Um, but again, their offensive coordinator was basically a trash bag last year.
46:53There's going to be some change there. They did make some changes.
46:57They got rid of AJ Brown. They drafted Eli stores and, and Makai lemon.
47:01There's obviously a plan. This isn't haphazard. They're not like, wait, we have Makai lemon.
47:06Now, what do we do? Like there's some thought that's going into this.
47:10They do have an idea of what they want to do.
47:14And to some, to some degree, somebody has got to get those targets.
47:18And, uh, I would bet it's the guy who earned targets at a ridiculous rate and is super dangerous after the, I
47:25mean, come on guys, Makai lemon, please. This is rude.
47:28This is crazy. Yeah. I actually, I wrote up my thoughts on the AJ Brown trade impacts, both from the AJ Brown
47:35side and from the Eagle side on the first, the first installment of the TPS report boys on the site.
47:42So go check it out. I, uh, dropped that last week.
47:45Um, thank you so much for calling it the TPS report just for me, just for my pleasure.
47:51So I've wanted to have some piece of content called the TPS report.
47:55Those are my initials, by the way, for anybody listening.
47:58And I'm also a big fan of the movie office space.
48:02Um, so yeah, it felt good to get that out and it's going to be my little reaction to things that happen in the NFL.
48:10Sometimes it'll be quicker write-ups. I have a hard time going quick though.
48:14So if you check this one out, it's a bunch of advanced data and stuff in there.
48:19I don't love toot my own horn, but I actually got my buddy Scott Barrett to give it a read for me just because he takes a look.
48:28Sometimes he told me it was elite. So hopefully you enjoy it as well.
48:33He would probably just toot my own horn because he has to.
48:36He's my buddy, but that's okay. Um, but it was fun to write and I'm, I'm writing another piece right now.
48:43So just keep an eye on the site for that stuff and go to that article.
48:48If you want my full thoughts on the, uh, the impact of the AJ Brown trade, including Devante Smith and Makai Lemon thoughts.
48:56But yeah, in this round boys, I'm seeing like not a ton.
48:59By the way, what's the middle is the middle name?
49:03Benjamin. Is it? Philadelphia. Pale. Pale. Yeah. It's pale.
49:05Pale. Yeah. There you go. That's me boys. That's me.
49:09That's my government name. I knew I remembered at one point.
49:12Benjamin was what was on my mind. Any spells in this round before, before you move on?
49:18I mean, it's an interesting one. I don't see a ton actually.
49:21Not a ton. I think Javante, Javante Williams. I think the wheels could fall off that one at any point.
49:28Not maybe because of injury, but also potentially down the road of the Cowboys trying out other people in that role.
49:34If there's any, without looking, any idea how old Javante is?
49:38Don't look. He's only like 25. 25? Just turned 26.
49:41Yeah. A lot of tread on the requires Josh Jacobs.
49:44The other one, the other one I'll say in the sixth round is Brian Thomas, right?
49:49Like, so obviously the, you know, as Jackson alluded to, it was a huge fade for him last off season.
49:56I didn't see it. I believed in the talent.
49:59I was wrong. That being said, I think the hate may have gone too far and his true value probably lies somewhere in between.
50:06Agree. He should probably be somewhere in that late fourth, early fifth.
50:10And there's a pretty good value. Yep. Yeah. And this is the spot in the draft where I'm, this happens to me every year.
50:18I'm basically taking elite wide receivers until there aren't any.
50:21And then I'll take running backs because that's where we found Javante Williams last year.
50:26Right? Like, so you get these guys, like there's, that's where Cam Scadabo came from last year.
50:31Right? Post fifth, sixth round where you can, where there was no more, you know, elite wide receivers left, but there were
50:38running backs who could all of a sudden be like kind of awesome.
50:42They shall toot and further down, we're going to talk about, but there's always these running backs with, with legit upside that are further down the board.
50:51I want to tether my team to having four or five, six, depending on how deep the starting rosters are elite wide
50:58receivers that I don't, I set and forget. I'm not playing, you know, fantasy whack-a-mole with my wide receivers that I have 12 of.
51:06And I'm like, which one should I play? I want to do that with running backs.
51:11And I want to play the running back. That's got, you know, a start this George Helani is starting week two or so.
51:18I'll put George Helani in the virgen lineup, but I'm never going to do that with, you know, the, the wide receiver equivalent further down the board.
51:27So this is the point where I'm with you.
51:30I'm just taking all these widers. I'm looking at even Jamison Williams, who has dunked on me two straight years and has had top 15 wide receiver finishes.
51:38Yes. Sometimes infuriating with goose eggs, but he's finished there.
51:42He's going at wide receiver 28 Jalen Waddle, uh, who we're going to get to, but this is crazy.
51:48This is where all this wide receiver value just sort of stacks up and I'm looking to smash at home.
51:54And we're back on dynasty underground going through round by round in startup ADP via OTC FFP.com to find you the best
52:01values, the most mispriced ADPs and the players who could see the biggest jumps after this coming season.
52:07So we're going to get into the seventh round.
52:10Now, guys, we've gone through the first six, we're going to go through 10 rounds on this show and then we'll cut it off.
52:17Check out that ADP tool and let us know what you find out of any of those rounds that are after the 10th round, maybe.
52:25So looking at the seventh Jacks, you mentioned, uh, previously Jalen Waddle is one of those wide receivers you'd be firing on at wide receiver 29.
52:34I think he's an absolute steal there. Joe, do you see anything popping out for you in the seventh round?
52:40That's, that's, uh, staring at you. Joe, Joe, I'm just going to say real quick before you go that actually, if you
52:47look at Jalen Waddle here at wide receiver 29, that's about where the line of demarcation is for young stud wide receivers.
52:54Now, again, you can define that however you wish, but I'm just basically saying, look, guys that are, you know, 27 or
53:01less and like still pretty productive, you know? And I think that's where the line ends.
53:06And then you get into the DJ Moores and, you know, players like that, just Alec Pierce, who I'm not sure of,
53:13you know, just different types of bets after Jalen Waddle, who's a clear wide receiver one for his own team and still relatively at least young.
53:21So anyway, long story short, I just was trying to point out that at that point, once they're all gone, now I'm
53:29just looking at all the other positions and just smashing them as I go and maybe picking off some wide receiver value here and there.
53:36But now I'm ready to just take value at other positions.
53:40That's just my strategy here at, uh, at this point.
53:43So some of these running backs are a little bit dirtier, but I actually like a lot of the running backs here
53:50just because they're here and not higher. That makes sense.
53:53Well, um, I completely agree. This is about the turning point where it's just like best available slash, you know, kind of
54:00combination of age and upside is what you're looking for or that dirty, cheap old production.
54:05Yeah. But, um, I mean, I think it would be just so cliche of me to, um, bang the drum for Basial Tootin one more time.
54:14That is my real, that is my, that is my real, you're wearing the shirt.
54:19Bang it. That is my real answer here, but I'm not, I'm going to spare the people.
54:24They know how much I love Basial Tootin. Uh, the, the case keeps getting stronger for him.
54:29And I think that's going to continue to be the case.
54:33I think he could easily be a, I don't know, third round pick this time next year in startups, right?
54:39I think he could be in that echelon. Yeah.
54:42Uh, with his big playability in that offense at his age, um, definitely could be, and should be probably in that chase
54:49Brown range at the very least this time next year.
54:52I agree. Um, but, uh, I think the answer to me is a little unorthodox here, but I'm going to go with Tyler shot.
55:00And, you know, this is one that we were making fun of last year.
55:04Uh, and we're just big, wrong, loud, wrong about, but now we're in year two, Chuck, Kellen Moore offense.
55:11They brought in weapons around them by way of, um, my boy, Oscar Delp and, uh, oh, that one wide receiver they
55:18took in the top 10 as well. Um, so it just keeps getting better for him and they brought an ETN also.
55:25They still have Kamara. It's like all of the easy buttons are going to be there for him in a fast paced offense.
55:32I don't think Moore is getting fired anytime soon.
55:35So assuming he doesn't have a big time sophomore slump and fall flat on his face in a high volume offense.
55:41I think he is a player that could be viewed in a much more favorable light a year from now.
55:48So I, I sent out a tweet, Joe, and the, the thought exercise was very simple in my mind.
55:54I was going through the quarterbacks that are, you know, all the quarterbacks in the NFL and saying, okay, of the ones
56:01that are starting right now, or, you know, even Mendoza who may not be starting, but he's, you know, one of the
56:08top 20, 30, you know, uh, quarterbacks in dynasty, of course, of those guys, how many of these guys are sure to be starting week one, 2027, right?
56:17So fast forward a year from now and there's the starting quarterback for their team in 2027 that really almost nothing conceivably
56:24could happen to them in the 2026 season that would separate them from their job.
56:29Tyler Shuck is not one of those players. He is.
56:32Shuck has major, major tuxedo risk. Yes. Oh yeah.
56:35He is the quarterback. He is the quarterback tuxedo risk of the 2026 season.
56:39It's like, oh yeah. Fast face offense to young wide receivers.
56:43Yes. Good tight ends. Good running game. What could go wrong?
56:46Yeah. And if he falls flat on his face, it's like, oh, well, yeah, no, this guy was a second round pick that we hated as a prospect.
56:55Like obviously this wasn't going to work. Yes. He is the, he's prancing around in the tuxedo as we speak.
57:02Oh my God. That needs to be, that needs to be the thumbnail.
57:06He's handsome. It's got to be Shuck in a tuxedo.
57:09Yeah. With his helmet on. A tuxedo. So good.
57:12A shuxedo. The entire Saints offense. Shuxedo for the win.
57:15Yeah. The entire Saints offense is cloaked in a shuxedo right now.
57:19And that's the episode, episode title. Shuxedo risk. Oh my God.
57:22Dude. It's so good. It's a nice three piece or if it was bought at the thrift store yet, but time will tell.
57:30Holy shit. Shuxedo is hilarious. Yeah. I thought that was a good one.
57:34Wow. That is so good. I'm here all week.
57:37I'm here all week. Yep. That was funny. I have an alarming amount of Shuck in best ball too, but he's going a lot later.
57:45That's a nice play in best ball this year, especially with the stack oppos too.
57:49I like that, Joe. I like that. Absolutely. I was going to throw, you guys know I'm a little bit bullish on Cam Ward.
57:57I was going to throw that kind of the theme of the round.
58:01As we can see, there's four quarterbacks in this round.
58:04Cam Ward, man. I think I'm doing a bit of a study on what the realistic expectations can be of these pylon quarterbacks.
58:12And I'll tell you, it's definitely not a top five perennial quarterback.
58:15We know that already, but these guys can still be strong quarterback to producers.
58:20And I think at this place in a draft, if we look at Cam Ward and we think he can be one
58:27of those guys who can throw for 4,000 and reach near 30 touchdowns.
58:31I think he's one of those guys who probably has less things that could happen to him in 26 to ruin his
58:38starting job in 27 than does a shuck. So I would be going Cam Ward there just for some of that maybe stability that I think he has.
58:47And then I think 26 will bring him with a solid season, albeit he is going to be a pylon.
58:53So that upside is limited, but I think he could be a solid one.
58:58This is the middle of that middle class that I'm talking about, right?
59:02It's really like QB eight to QB 24. It's like, could the QB 24?
59:07I don't even know who that is. Could they rise to QB eight?
59:11Yeah. Matthew Stafford, Kyler Murray at 23, Darnold at 22, Stroud at 21, 801 as we look in the eighth round.
59:17I will say I prefer Darnold and Stroud over Ward and shuck, not because I think that their ceiling is higher, but
59:24their floor seems way more secure in 2026. And, you know, I, I think it comes down to that thing where, you
59:31know, I hate to make a pick. And then the next year it's just worthless.
59:36You know, the Caleb Johnson, not, not to, you know, call out your boy there, Joe, we all, we all, you know, you get my point.
59:44You, you make that pick and you're like, it's just dead.
59:48I mean, we've all done it. It's not a, it's not a Joe thing.
59:52It's, you know, it just happens and you're just trying your damnedest to avoid it.
59:57And so just sort of peeking at the, what the trap door looks like and trying to see if there's any, you
60:04know, Hey, is this floral, you know, looking down there?
60:07Cause we have, we're so hopeful with every pick shuck.
60:11Yeah. He's got a love. He's got this. Kellen Moore.
60:14This is going to be great. And yeah, that's there.
60:17That ceiling exists. I see that. I agree with what you're saying there.
60:21I just also think it's healthy to be like, if it doesn't go well and they're losing and he's kind of like,
60:28if he is the tuxedo risk, like they're going to be like, you know, it's, it's Kenny Pickett.
60:34It's Zach Wilson. It's all these guys. Kenny Pickett dude was being traded for a first round pick.
60:40I know because I traded him away for a first round pick after his rookie year.
60:45It's what it is. And I think shuck isn't even bringing that high, you know, a price right now, but like there
60:52is still that optimism, you know, so I would just be careful as all buyer beware.
60:57Yeah. And I think with that, like, as we get further down in these rounds, you can have more tolerance for that type of shuckseed risk.
61:05Right. So here in the eighth round is where you're starting to take on a little bit more of that risk.
61:12And so if you have some of that belief, like Joe is saying he has, I can see you taking some more of those shots.
61:20By the way, before we go, any cells, cause I've got a couple I'd like to mention.
61:25Yeah. There's a couple. I would be selling Kyler Murray for sure.
61:29If somebody wants to know. I'm in the, in the seventh.
61:33Oh, the seventh. Right. We're back in the seventh.
61:35That's right. No, just quickly. Is there, is there, is there a, is there a sell there?
61:41The guys I'm not crazy about, obviously Kenyon Sadiq.
61:44I think we've talked about this ad nauseum. I think Jadarian Price, as interesting as he is, is a first round running back.
61:51Like I don't feel great about that. And he was just barely a first round running back on a team that has
61:58been known to bench first round running backs for more productive undrafted guys behind him.
62:03Yeah. There's a, there's a bunch of guys. I mean, Kenyon Sadiq, RJ Harvey is a bit of a sell for me,
62:10as you guys know, especially at RB 25. No, thank you.
62:13You know, Jadarian Price, at least I can see the temporary upside, you know, for a year or two.
62:19He has what RJ Harvey had last year going in, you know, it's like, Hey, he's going to be good.
62:26So, you know, at least he's priced in that general vicinity of where, you know, Harvey's at now.
62:32But I'm with you because we may get to it in a minute.
62:36And of course I will. But like, when you look at Kenyon Sadiq, there is a tight end going much later than
62:43the tight end nine at the 709 that I'd much rather have.
62:47So I think we'll get there in a moment.
62:49So yeah, let's get into this eighth round here because right at the top, I think the guy that you were talking about is the 802 Oronde Gadsden.
62:58At even further down, buddy, even further down. Okay, well, we're going to get there then, buddy.
63:04Let's let's just rule our jets on that. That's exciting, sir.
63:07Or I think Oronde Gadsden as the tight end 10 in the eighth round is incredible.
63:12We all have him in our top seven comfortably and him going at tight end 10.
63:17I'd be smashing him at the eighth round. I think I was mentioning to you guys off air.
63:23I have an article similar to this flavor that maybe goes a little bit more rounds.
63:28It's going to talk about some of my favorite players to target in those rounds.
63:33So spoiler alert, Oronde Gadsden is my eighth round selection.
63:36So super excited to write that one up. Joe, what are you seeing?
63:40I don't think you're getting Gadsden in the eighth round.
63:44I think that if you want Gadsden, you have to take him in the seventh.
63:48I mean, I'm actually noticing it. Obviously, this is not apples to apples.
63:53And if you actually look at his ADP over time, it's been dropping.
63:57And that's probably because of the addition of David Njoku.
64:00So I don't know. Maybe you can't get Gadsden in the eighth round because people are freaked out about Njoku.
64:06That couldn't be more wrong. I mean, it couldn't be more wrong.
64:10And not only that, I mean, we literally just saw another dope young player just put Njoku in the passenger seat.
64:17And Harold Fann, right? Yep. So why can Gadsden do the same thing, even in two tight ends?
64:23It's like, great. Yeah. And Njoku, great blocker. Have him do that while Gadsden's running down the seam, having 160-yard games as rookie tight ends, right?
64:31Tell me who else is doing that at that age, right?
64:34So, yeah. No, he's given us all the buy signals.
64:38If you're not a believer yet and you're scared of latter day Njoku, I'm sorry.
64:42And please don't pass up on him if he falls to you in the eighth.
64:47So aside from... With that, real quick, not to mention that Gadsden has a doper play caller than did Harold Fannin last year.
64:54So, yeah, much like you said, if you are thinking that Oronde Gadsden takes a hit, you are in Jokin.
65:01Yeah. And not only that, but his play caller also just emphasizes mismatches, right?
65:05And so where is he going to get that mismatch, right?
65:09And if Lad McConkie, you know, who we talked about, he can play inside and outside.
65:14But when he's outside, it's like not the best, right?
65:17He's not like a dominant outside receiver. He's adequate outside receiver and awesome in slot.
65:22I think that mismatch is going to more often than not exist with a dude like Gadsden.
65:27So, yeah, I've been acquiring as much as I can.
65:30I've drafted him in startups much higher than this and would continue to do so because I think I've got him at, yeah, six, probably six or seven.
65:39I can't recall. Yeah. Outside of that, in this eighth round, I don't know, man.
65:44These are a bunch of maybes. These are a bunch of maybes.
65:48I think Christian Watson has my attention. But, I mean, Wilson and Watson, but they're like the same bet, right?
65:54They're the same bet. And if you were to ask me objectively, I'd say they're bad bets.
66:00Like what we saw last season, we can't unsee.
66:03But out of this group, I don't know. I think I've got the answer.
66:07The answer in this group is Casey Concepcion. He's the one, absolutely, because he's the one that, like, if you're here with
66:14Arande Gadsden, by the way, I think C.J. Stroud also is someone I'd be happy to catch the falling knife with.
66:21Same thing with Sam Darnold. These are the types of quarterbacks I'm like, sweet.
66:25I got Sam Darnold out here. Like, this is great.
66:28But I would be willing to take Casey Concepcion even a round or two earlier than this.
66:34I do think he's in and among those other wide receivers that I mentioned, Young, Stud.
66:39Again, is he a stud? Of course we don't know.
66:42But he is a first-round wide receiver, drafted as the wide receiver one on his team, albeit a team with a lot of question marks.
66:50There is no doubt about that. But someone's going to get the targets, and it sounds like it's going to be Casey
66:57Concepcion that's in that sort of alpha queen chess piece chair.
67:01And he's got all the requisite skills and, you know, model sort of traits that we like to see, size, speed, everything else is also checking boxes.
67:09I think Casey Concepcion at this particular point is an absolute steal.
67:13I'd be taking him well ahead of this. I want to go back to, I like that take.
67:19I think Casey Concepcion is probably a six-round pick next year because I think he is going to become that wide receiver one in Cleveland.
67:27I want to go back to Christian Watson because I think he is the guy that is glaring here out of these
67:34wide receiver groups who I think has massive upside.
67:37He was so good when he came back last year.
67:40I think the only risk is that he gets injured.
67:43And this is the eighth round. This is where I'm going to have a little bit more tolerance for that kind of
67:50risk if I'm in the need for a wide receiver.
67:53So if I drafted, like you mentioned, Jackson, I've got four or five wide receivers right now.
67:59Maybe I'm not doing this. But if we look at Christian Watson, that team is begging for an alpha.
68:05Matthew Golden is not it. I put out a tweet earlier this week.
68:09His current ADP right now in startups is right around wide receiver 34 here in the back of the eighth.
68:15In the last 10 weeks of last season, he was 14th in receiving yards among wide receivers, eighth in yards per route
68:22run, fifth in touchdowns, third in deep targets. We know that chicks dig the long ball.
68:27And then he was fifth in fantasy points per route run with 0.58.
68:32So those are top 10 wide receiver numbers that he was putting up over the back half of the season.
68:38So if he's healthy, I think he has that type of upside in 2026.
68:42I love it. I tend to agree. He seems like the lock to kind of be the every down wide receiver or
68:49the highest plays wide receiver on Green Bay, assuming health, which is a big assumption with him.
68:55And that's the tantalizing upside and the terrifying downside with him, which is why he's here and not significantly higher.
69:01He probably just based on the upside could be, you could make a cash from in the 20s.
69:07Yeah. And right now I just went to sleepers ADP just to see where they have them.
69:12Sometimes there's a lag or whatever. He's at wide receiver 36.
69:16So, you know, very close to here. I was wondering if sometimes you'll be able to get Christian Watson a bit later
69:23than wide receiver 34 is what I guess I'm getting at.
69:26And he may be one of those players that like falls in your lap.
69:31I'd love for Christian Watson to fall in my lap, you know, in a startup draft where it's just like, dude, 10-0-1.
69:38I just, you know what I mean? Like where it's just stupid, right?
69:42So there's some spots like that. And he's the type of player I'd love for that to happen to me.
69:48There was a startup that I called or texted you guys to help me with where I was debating some stuff at
69:55the end of the seventh, beginning of the eighth, where I was wide receiver needy.
70:00And anyways, long story short, I think you guys talked me out of Michael Wilson and Christian Watson there.
70:06And I traded on my eighth round pick. I moved up a little bit in the seventh and then I had a
70:13couple of nights and they both, this is in April, of course, but they both fell to me in the ninth round.
70:20And so I just double tapped them. I was like, one of them is probably going to work out and it's going to be an adequate starter.
70:29And the other one's probably going to be a disappointment.
70:32And I'm not sure which one, but yeah. To my point.
70:36Yeah. Yeah. To your point. But I don't think he's falling much further than ninth and given the recent steam and the
70:43new contract, I think it's much more likely that you'll get Wilson in the ninth than you will Watson at this point.
70:50Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I think there's a little bit of tuxedo risk with Michael Wilson, but I'm not going to get too deep into that right now.
70:58No, you're right though. That's true. When we get into that 10 Oh one Jacks, you only got about a 15% chance of getting Christian Watson there.
71:07So yeah, probably late eighth is, is where you got to go for him.
71:11You could try and stretch it to the ninth, but be okay with not getting him in that situation.
71:17Very nice boys on that, on that eighth round.
71:20Let's take a look at the ninth here. Your boy, Omar Cooper slots in as the nine Oh four Jacks.
71:27Wandale, the nine Oh six. I think that's a little bit scary for me.
71:31What are you guys seeing in the ninth round?
71:34You want me to go ahead and go ahead.
71:37Well, it's Dalton Kincaid, right? I mean, Oh yeah, this was the tight end.
71:41I mean, look, I'm not a huge Dalton Kincaid fan, but he was super efficient per route run.
71:47If he can just find his way onto the field a bit more, he was a trusted target for, for Josh Allen.
71:54I think he's, he hasn't put up the raw numbers that were necessary seeking because of the limited playing time.
72:00There's been some injury. There's been some behind Dawson Knox stuff.
72:04There's just, just some stuff. I just wonder if they can find a way to get them on.
72:10He doesn't even have to be a hundred percent snap share player.
72:13He just needs to be, you know, 70 ish, right?
72:17Just kind of enough to have some viability. So I think Dalton Kincaid, especially at the tight end position where we're talking, he's the tight end 12.
72:25He's almost at the 10 on one nine 11 ADP.
72:28You know, we were talking outside the top 100 picks, right?
72:32This is just, I don't know. To me, this is like easy money.
72:36You just really want to not overthink it and get yourself a player at Dalton Kincaid, especially.
72:42I don't know, man. I just give me Dalton Kincaid at this price.
72:46That's all I'm saying. Yep. For me, there's one clear, clear answer here and that's Malik Willis.
72:51Yep. And it's just an asymmetrical upside bet. What did we talk about off the top, right?
72:57Who are the quarterbacks that are going early? It's the dudes that have the rushing floor combined with, you know, passing efficiency
73:04that gets them into that upper echelon. Here's your chance.
73:07I'll be it a low probability one that Malik Willis is the answer in Miami.
73:12That Malik Willis actually is the dude we want him to be.
73:15Hope he is what he was kind of hyped up as during the pre-draft process in his leading up to his rookie year.
73:23And then the disappointment that followed, the journeyman that figures it out in the middle of his career on his third contract.
73:30Right? This is the screaming upside play, especially in Superflex League, obviously.
73:34So I'm willing to take the shot on Malik Willis.
73:37I've gotten him in, I think, both of the startups that I did where I grabbed the CJ Stroud in the eighth round.
73:44And I'm like, OK, cool. I'm good with CJ Stroud as my QB2.
73:48And that's my safety net backup plan. But I'm going to go for upside with Malik Willis the next round, because if
73:55he hits, he's a top 10 quarterback. He's probably like a top seven quarterback with the rushing upside.
74:01So that's the bet I'm willing to make. And I love adding him as the QB3 with QB1 upside.
74:07And he will never be valued as a top 10 quarterback ever, ever.
74:11He could produce that way for three seasons, and he probably wouldn't be a top 10 dynasty quarterback in Malik Willis.
74:18And we're talking about that quarterback upside. Obviously, you need some rushing.
74:22I think in a Superflex League, one of those quarterbacks for me has to be somebody who brings some rushing.
74:28And so as you were talking, you got to it, Joe, talking about Stroud.
74:33But I was thinking I was talking about Ward.
74:35If you waited on quarterbacks and you tap a Ward in the seventh and you come back and you get yourself a
74:42little bit of Malik Willis in the ninth, I think that's a decent little pairing like you're mentioning.
74:48So, yeah. Well, I've got Malik Willis in a couple of leagues and everywhere I've got him.
74:54I'm just thinking like he could be, you know, production wise.
74:57It's the Anthony Richardson thing where it's like, look, if he plays, I'm pretty sure he's going to be a top 15 quarterback in fantasy.
75:05Joe, the biggest problem, and I mean, I know I'm beating a dead horse here, but the biggest problem with Malik Willis
75:12is the rest of this offense that just seems like, I'm like, who's he?
75:17What is it? Dulcich and like Malik Washington are his weapon?
75:20Like, this is crazy. Yeah. Right? I mean, Chris Bell's not even ready yet.
75:25I mean, he's an ACL repair coming back. Like, so, you know, I really do love the player and the potential upside.
75:32Like, honestly, if he was on like any other team with a starting opportunity, like the whole Arizona thing is one that
75:39kills me because I mean, he would just absolutely shred in Arizona.
75:42But unfortunately, he's not there. So, you know, the what we can reasonably expect in Miami is not good.
75:48And then on the flip side, Miami is going to be like, well, we're just tanking anyway.
75:54Like, so they don't really even have a commitment to winning.
75:57So even if Malik Willis is winning or not winning or whatever, like they could be so flippant with him and just
76:04be like, oh, yeah, we're just going to sit him.
76:08And like, there's just so many like outcomes where it's not even his fault and he could be, you know, not playing.
76:15On top of that, there's the ones that could be his fault.
76:18That are the reasons he's not playing. So there's a there's a ton of outs that are not good.
76:24The one where he just stays on the field and plays all season.
76:29You know, I just don't know exactly where that upside lies.
76:32Well, the upside. I mean, you get him at QB 26 prices and he could be a QB 10 by production.
76:39Right. That's where the upside lies. And it could be just based entirely on rushing.
76:44Right. Is that a longevity play? No, it's a gamble.
76:47Yeah. In the ninth round is where I'm willing to gamble, because if you hit, you hit big.
76:53Yep. And so that's like that. That's the whole thing.
76:56Well, you think of it this way, Joe. Joe, last year we were drafting Stafford and Devante in this range.
77:02Right. Yeah. And the bet wasn't that Stafford was going to retain this job for five years.
77:07It was a one or two year bet. We knew that.
77:11But we felt like it was going to be such a great season.
77:15That it was worth it. Now, for different reasons, Malik Willis is a similar bet.
77:20Yeah. Right. You know, funny how contrasting those are.
77:23Yeah. It is. But what did you need from Stafford?
77:26You needed the 7% touchdown rate. Guess what? He hit it.
77:29Yeah. Totally. He hit it. And we cashed. Right.
77:3250 rushing yards a game from Malik Willis. And he could hit that.
77:37Exactly. Exactly. And he probably will do that because they're going to run the ball a lot.
77:42He'll be running for his damn life. Give me 175 yards, two touchdowns, and 50 rushing yards a game.
77:48I'm going to be a very, very happy Malik Willis owner until week eight when he gets hurt and or gets matched.
77:55Yeah. And I'll take those wins. I'm not above that.
77:58I'll take those wins. Yeah. You'd be a happy little swinger.
78:02Hey, Joe? Yeah. Absolutely. And, you know, the great thing is also if he does perform well but fails because of his
78:09surrounding cast, he seems like the kind of guy that's going to have a job for a long time and end up being a backup somewhere else.
78:17It's not like he's going to be a roster clogger.
78:21It's going to be a guy you want on your team anyways, right?
78:25It could very well have a bit of a ping pong, you know, bounce around and then finally land somewhere else opportunity type of thing.
78:33Yeah. Absolutely. For sure. Yeah. A little Jacoby Brissette career arc or something like that.
78:37Yep. Another guy who's looking at me who gets a lot of steam.
78:42I'm still not 100% sure if I'm sold on Parker Washington, but if people think that he's going to be the wide
78:49receiver one in Jacksonville at the 912, I think that's definitely some value there.
78:53Yeah. And hey, shout out to my guy Chuba Hubbard.
78:56Canadian. Absolute afterthought for fantasy gamers. Absolute afterthought. But maybe not for Dynasty, but I think this coming season he could have a decent year.
79:04Jonathan Brooks is no sure thing. Rico Dowdle is no longer in the picture.
79:09Chuba Hubbard has been the workhorse for this team before.
79:12So just had to give a shout out to my fellow Canadian and a guy who I once got the chance to interview.
79:19Voice. I think we all know what Chuba Hubbard is and what the downfall and what the pitfalls are.
79:25I actually really want to have the Parker Washington conversation with you guys.
79:29I don't think we've had this conversation. Not yet.
79:32And I don't know how to feel. I've always liked the talent.
79:36I've always liked the player. It seems like everything they've said this offseason is talking about getting him on the field more,
79:43giving him a more diverse route tree, having him play more outside.
79:47And that's exactly what we want. A dude that was a slot that now starts playing outside a little bit.
79:53It's like check, check, check. But obviously, Jacoby Myers, target earner.
79:57Brian Thomas, you know, freak athlete that was, you know, he's the prince that was promised.
80:02And then talk about prince that was promised. And Travis Hunter, also on that team.
80:07You mean he who shall not be named? Opposite Harry Potter character, sir.
80:11Yeah. And then they draft two tight ends signaling they're going to try and play more 12 and possibly even the 13
80:18personnel thing as a guy from the McVay tree running the offense here.
80:22So there are just so many question marks, which I think is suppressing all of their value.
80:27But I'm genuinely perplexed with Parker Washington. I don't have zero exposure.
80:31Yeah. I have some. I feel like I should have more.
80:35But I want to just have the conversation with you guys.
80:38You guys remember Travis Fulgham? Yeah. Big stretch he had with the Eagles.
80:42I'm not saying that. I think. That wasn't a big stretch.
80:46That was a two-week stretch. It was like four weeks.
80:49Four weeks. So Parker Washington was longer than that.
80:52But I'm saying, what I'm saying is Parker Washington has a better chance at that.
80:57But that fizzle out outcome is in his range of outcomes.
81:00You know what I mean? Sure. And so that's what scares me a little bit.
81:05Kind of like piggybacking on what you said, Joe.
81:08It just feels a little bit scary. At 9-12, okay, it's fine.
81:12And we can kind of take shots there if we need a wide receiver.
81:16But it just feels a little bit scary to be anchoring to the fact that he's going to be what we saw for that small sample last year.
81:25I don't disagree with that. But I will just note, I picked up on Parker Washington in his rookie year when he made a couple of plays.
81:34I was like, dude, this guy's pretty damn good.
81:37Yes. And then he kind of got buried. And then he reemerges last year and becomes the focal point of the passing game.
81:44And literally after we thought it had officially become Jacoby Myers, like Parker Washington sort of took over, especially down the stretch.
81:51So while we're talking, I'm just going to try and find his OTC score.
81:55So you guys keep going. I'm going to pull up Parker Washington's OTC score.
82:00By the way, while you're doing that, any idea how old Parker Washington is?
82:04I'm going to say he's 25. Yeah, he's 24.
82:07Oh, damn. Damn. He's younger than Ricky Pearsall. Hmm.
82:10Hmm. Just saying. Damn good. That's pretty damn good.
82:13I mean, you know, so I think there's something to this Parker Washington thing.
82:17I think he is pretty good, Joe, to your point.
82:21And but I don't know how much that means because he's playing with Brian Thomas Jr.
82:26He's playing with with Jacoby Myers. He's playing with Travis Hunter or is he?
82:30I'm not sure. But at least those two guys, I think he's going to be on the field.
82:36And I think he's going to be good. But there's a lot of I thinks and I'm not sure is there.
82:43And that's really my biggest issue. If it was somehow like just carved out for him a little bit better, I'd be all in.
82:50But of course, his price would be higher. But I think at this price, it's worth it because, you know, you're drafting him right around Ricky Pearsall.
82:59I'd much rather have Parker Washington than Ricky Pearsall.
83:02Definitely. Me personally, for sure. Oh, yeah. You know, so at that particular point, you know, I'm fine with it.
83:08I think there are some other pretty interesting bets around Parker Washington, like a Jaden Higgins and things like that.
83:15But I think he's in the right zone. Yeah.
83:17I think if if you built your team in a way where you can afford this swing, it's worth it.
83:24You know? Yeah. And I think I know his.
83:27Yeah. Go ahead, Joe. I was going to say his OTC score was a 58.69.
83:31So not good. Not good. Not good. Not the kind of guy we bet on.
83:36I mean, obviously, when you've shown something in the league that supersedes this a little bit, but we do take it with a grain of salt.
83:44Um, I'm kind of inclined to. I'm I'm it pushes me more towards doubt on a guy I'm on the fence about.
83:52I agree. Right. He's not even in the maybe zone.
83:55He's in the this is a bad bet zone.
83:58Yeah. And that sample I'm talking about is from week nine on last season.
84:02He was the wide receiver 17 in points per game with 14.2.
84:06He would be the wide receiver 18 boys, but I excluded one player who only had one game played.
84:12This one player was the wide receiver two in points per game between weeks nine through 18.
84:17Only one game played, but that player was Torrey Horton.
84:21I just felt like we had to, you know, pump our guy a little bit might be the last chance we ever
84:28get to fucking pump him if I'm being completely honest.
84:31So Torrey Horton was the wide receiver two in points per game from week nine on last year, folks.
84:37Yes. Um, yeah, that's good. Good Parker. Oh, what a week it was.
84:41Good Parker, Washington conversation. And I think one that there's going to be a lot of fantasy gamers on the edge of
84:48their seats about to see that one play out for sure.
84:51You know, it's funny. You're looking at the page where Parker Washington is on this page and it's like the best players.
84:58There's a whole page and these are the best players in and around him at the OTC score.
85:04It's like, uh, hold on. Let me find some Khalil Shakir.
85:08Um, hold on. It's hard to find good ones.
85:11Khalil Shakir. Of course, Terry McLaurin, Romeo dubs. When you say around when Terry McLaurin was in the sixties, was he not?
85:1859. Oh, wow. Okay. That's the best comp for sure.
85:21That's the highest, the best ceiling comp. Like Boutte and DK Metcalf.
85:25That's the type of players you're looking at there.
85:27So, but that's of, uh, you know, those, those comps, you know, the DK Metcalf, Terry McLaurin, that's, you know, there's 30 players in this like group.
85:36And there's a few that have, that have panned out, you know, uh, amongst the rest is, you know, Gary Jennings juniors
85:43and Jalen Hyatt's and Gabe Davis's and Kyle Phillips and Trey Quan Smith's and Equinemius St.
85:48Brown's and Terrace Marshall's and all the rest of them.
85:51And, you know, there's just a lot of the guys in this area.
85:56Don't, don't pan out. Um, I will say Parker Washington though, at this particular point, I think has done more, especially on
86:03a per route basis than almost anybody in his range.
86:06So it could obviously Terry McLaurin, not, you know, notwithstanding, but yeah, I mean, he's just done, he's done a lot to, to show his way.
86:14And I think once they sort of break through into, uh, into the, the NFL, you kind of have to look at the score a little bit different.
86:23I think it's a good way to pick sleepers and, and guys that we think might turn around, but I think excluding
86:30guys, uh, who have shown that they're still good in the league.
86:34Like I'm, I'm no longer worried about Terry McLaurin.
86:37Right. You know, sometimes, you know, the whole idea of that model is it's not necessarily a linear model, meaning that it's
86:44not trying to just say, Hey, these are the best players.
86:47Cause really draft capital does that. It's really trying to solve for a different equation and it will get some things wrong,
86:54but on the, on the, on the whole, it's obviously an extremely good tool, but yeah, I'm with you.
87:00Sometimes you can see something where it's like, he was also great in the model.
87:05Then you're like, Oh, maybe we should pay attention to this.
87:09But yeah, I just think he was kind of an average prospect to be.
87:13To be sure. Yeah. And you know, to a certain extent though, it is also like, what are they going to do in their first three years?
87:22Right. And, uh, Parker Washington is entering year four.
87:25So didn't do much. Exactly. Right. We're kind of outside.
87:28We're now past that point with him. Um, and he has shown enough to at least give hope, uh, that he's, you know, going to be something.
87:36So I don't know, I guess I'm not walking away any more or less sure about what to do with them.
87:43And just, I'm going to have some shares for fear of missing out.
87:47I can't wait for the cell in round 10 though.
87:50That's what I'm looking forward to. Let's get to it.
87:54Let's get to it. Yeah. I mean, 10.01 is Ricky Pearsall.
87:57He is definitely staring at us there. I see it.
88:00It's 10.08. Isn't it? Jax, why don't you give it away?
88:0410.09. 10.09. Oh. Rip it. Let the people know who it is.
88:08It's Brenton Strange. It's Brenton Strange. Yeah. I'm only having fun.
88:11I'm only having fun with my friend. While Joe was off in Vegas trying to get some strange, Jax was sitting here
88:18trying to figure out how you could shit on Brenton Strange.
88:22Joe was in Vegas on the wrong side of the ratio in a threesome.
88:26Right. Yeah. You're back in your happy place though, Joe.
88:29We've got you. We've got you. This is the threesome you need.
88:3310.09. We selling Brenton Strange, Jax? Yeah. Come on.
88:36We're not even thinking about it. Zero shares, zero cares.
88:39Do I even have, I think I have one Brenton Strange and it's obviously a league Joe's not in.
88:45Um, I guess I would have sold him already.
88:48Bottom line is you don't love Strange. I mean, anymore.
88:51I don't know how to spell it even. It's spelled wrong here.
88:55Um, here's the thing. There's probably two guys that I really like in this round, but I will say there's actually more than that.
89:03There's two guys toward the bottom here in Denzel Boston and Jaden Higgins, who we talked about are very similar prospects.
89:09And if you're going to be able to get these guys in the 11th round, cause they're 10, 10, 10, 12 here.
89:16Boy, I really love that value for an opportunity at a wide receiver.
89:21That could absolutely be something down the line. Um, I, it's not exactly where I'm taking, um, you know, wide receivers, but
89:28as the ADP is falling, you know, it could be a way to go.
89:32This is where I'm taking like, and you'll see your guy right there.
89:36Blake Corum at the, at the 1101, by the way, also, because we're not going past round 10.
89:42I got to say when we were talking about Chuba Hubbard, I was like, oh, well, where's Jonathan Brooks?
89:48I had to scroll down. He's in the 12th round, like behind you, Corey Krosky Merritt, Jonathan Brooks, not in my leagues, buddy.
89:55Not in my leagues either. There's 0% chance. Jonathan Brooks is getting to the 12th round in any league I'm in.
90:02It's just not happening. I, I would take, so when we were talking about when was RJ Harvey, he was like in the seventh round or the seventh.
90:11Yeah. I have Jonathan Brooks over RJ Harvey straight up, like just straight up.
90:15I would rather have Jonathan Brooks and RJ Harvey today going forward, just period more upside.
90:21Now the downside. Yes, sure. I would say the downside on Brooks is greater than the downside on Harvey, but we're not playing for downside.
90:29We're playing for upside, especially at the running back position.
90:32I mean, what are we doing? I'm just going to take a backup guy who kind of gets in there sometimes.
90:38I just don't see him beating out Dobbins and Coleman in a way where he's like the undisputed, you know, 70% of
90:45everything running back on the Denver Broncos. Yeah. And he's old, but I can see that as a possibility for Jonathan Brooks.
90:52It's definitely in the cards and the way that the front office and coaching staff is talking, it may be more likely than not.
91:00So the lesson, again, just as a takeaway for the listener, if you're sitting in the eighth round looking at RJ Harvey,
91:07you trade back to like the late 10th, early 11th, and maybe pick up another 12th round pick.
91:13And you go grab yourself some Jonathan Brooks and another, you know, I don't know, aging wide receiver or something that you can lay in there.
91:21It's all Boston or Jaden Higgins along with him.
91:24Yeah. Yeah, exactly. If you get like a 10, 11 turn for the eighth, for like an eight 14th, eighth round pick
91:31and a 14th round pick, you do that and you take Brooks and Boston or Higgins and you're coming out ahead.
91:38Yes. This is kind of how you play the startups and exploit the flawed, very, very flawed ADPs.
91:43Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. I can't even imagine why he would be that far down the board.
91:49It doesn't even make any sense to me. Like, yeah, it's crazy.
91:52What you're doing there is you're doing a little bit of succession planning for your dynasty roster when you're taking a guy
91:59like Denzel Boston and Jonathan Brooks, because Jonathan Brooks is only 22 years old.
92:04Right. If we're looking at his probability at the 1101, it's 86% that you will get in there.
92:10And I would be fine with taking him at the top of the 11th round because the upside is just fat, especially
92:17for a running back in this zone. Like you've been talking about Jack's.
92:21Yes. I think that's absolutely money in the 12th round.
92:24So yeah, I think that's a good wrap boys.
92:27We got through the 10th round, gave a couple of extra guys that we liked in these rounds here.
92:33I think that was a fun show. Got to showcase the ADP tool as well.
92:38Joe, any big takeaways as we look at this ADP and ride out?
92:42Well, I think my takeaway, and it's not so much a takeaway for me, but just something I want to point out
92:49to the listener, like our website has so many cool tools.
92:52I'm actually still discovering some of the tools, but the year over year startup ADP values kind of tells you what historically has happened.
93:00And when you click on that tab, you can kind of see where you can typecast players in terms of like, okay,
93:07who was being valued like this last year and where are they now?
93:11Who is being typecast like this this year? And where do I think they're going to be a year from now?
93:18And that's that in and of itself can kind of lead you to steer clear of certain prototypes.
93:24Exactly. And that's all that in and of itself is super valuable.
93:27But I mean, when you can look at these charts and understand the direction the ADP is going and understand the probabilities
93:34of landing the player at a certain spot, I don't know of a better tool out there.
93:40It's like, seriously, I can't wait to do this startup.
93:43Now, of course, we're going to be playing with a bunch of people.
93:47We just told about the tools. Yeah. So it's going to throw a lot of whack.
93:52But I don't know. I feel like I've just been selling this thing for so long.
93:57You know what's cool? You know what's cool, Joe?
94:00Joe, you can actually go from like 21 to 22, 22 to 23.
94:04But anywhere from 2021 to 2026, you can see how players have year over year fallen.
94:09So even you could do between 2021 and 2026, although I think there's less to learn about that.
94:15But you could still see who the biggest riser or faller was from that day to today, which is kind of fun.
94:22So you could even take a two-year chunk, you know, 2023 to 2025 or whatever the case, you know, to try and
94:29use it as a little bit of a research tool or just fun as hell to play with.
94:35So totally. The year over year is the most telling, I think, to me, because you'll see these 30 year olds where
94:42something happens to them and all of a sudden their value falls off a cliff.
94:47So you have to understand the game that you're playing there.
94:50Well, and I think of, you know, I'm kind of deep into like data studies right now with writing some articles and things like that.
94:58I think of taking a look. So you want to take a position group, right?
95:03Okay. What was the movement for quarterbacks from 21 to 22, from 22 to 23, from 23 to 24?
95:09How did the running backs get impacted in that time and the wide receivers?
95:14And now what we're going to be seeing over the next couple of years is the tight ends with the heavier sets.
95:21And we've been talking about the fact that the tight end two on an NFL team is going to start to be
95:28a little bit more valuable over the next few years than maybe the wide receiver three is going to be.
95:34So I think there's just so many things that you can do with it.
95:38I think we've just scratched the surface on this show.
95:42And like Joe said, there's still times where we're finding out new things that Keegan's got in there that we didn't even know.
95:49So shout out to Keeg for all the great work.
95:52Shout out to all of the supporters who have signed up, the users, whether you're on a free or a paid account.
95:59We appreciate that you're checking our stuff out. And we really just want you getting in there, letting us know what's good
96:06about it, letting us know what could be sicker for you, because we want to be responsive and make this a tool for the people.
96:14So true that Jax, any parting shots before I ride this bad boy out?
96:19You said it. I mean, I think it's important to let the listeners and the users know that we are all ears
96:26and that we are constantly I mean, honestly, our little group chat is like, how can we make this thing better?
96:32Yeah. Not how can we exploit anything? It's like literally, how can we make this thing cooler?
96:38Because we love it so much. So it's a it's a tool that we just love making as awesome as possible.
96:44And I will say without saying too much that there may be some exciting things to come in the future.
96:51We are working as hard as we can to do all the things that we wish we could do.
96:57Some of those things are not at our behest.
97:00We do have to get some some help along the way, and we're asking for that help and we're making it happen.
97:07So there's some cool things coming. That's all I'm going to say.
97:11Giddy up for O.T. Giddy up. Giddy up. Giddy up.
97:14So that's another episode in the books for Dynasty Underground for Jax Falcone for Joe Quavius Kuvitakis in the Upside Down Pineapple shirt.
97:21I am Trav. We'll see you next week. Peace.

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