Harris Fantasy Football Podcast artwork

Previewing NFC West & A Super-Deep Sleeper From The Rams

STACKED extracted the fantasy-relevant player signal from this podcast and kept the full transcript here for context.

1 hr 7 min
Duration
Estimated from transcript
Jul 21, 2026
Published
Tue, July 21, 2026
29
Player insights
26
Players mentioned
Topics
Davante AdamsRicky PearsallTerrance FergusonBlake CorumCarson BeckChristian KirkChristian McCaffreyDK MetcalfEmanuel WilsonGeorge HolaniGeorge KittleJacoby BrissettJadarian PriceJames Conner
Player analysis

Player insights

29

Blake Corum

NegativeUsage33:20

Corum ran only 116 routes last year with 0.31 yards per route run, which is poor efficiency; the source does not expect camp buzz about increased receiving work to materially change his role, as his limited rookie receiving profile suggests he won't suddenly become a pass-game contributor despite his year-two role expansion in carries.

Insight page

Carson Beck

NegativeRole59:00

The source is monitoring Carson Beck's development and preseason performance, noting that if Beck gets significant playing time this year, it would be negative for the Cardinals' pass catchers relative to Brissett. Young quarterbacks tend to hold the ball longer, take higher sack rates, and scramble more, which would reduce the volume and efficiency of the passing game compared to Brissett's pocket-passing approach.

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Christian Kirk

PositiveMatchup41:20

Kirk is a secondary receiver for the 49ers; the source notes that Houston's December and playoff performance last year (where Kirk was productive) suggests he can be a reliable secondary option when the 49ers need him, though his role remains secondary to the primary receivers.

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Christian McCaffrey

NegativeInjury38:00

McCaffrey led the league in touches last year and is described as a really old back; the source expresses concern about the lack of a clear handcuff option, as neither Jordan James nor Kaelin Black has a strong receiving profile comparable to McCaffrey's elite pass-game role, creating significant injury risk.

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Davante Adams

NegativeProjection24:00

Adams finished WR7 with under 800 receiving yards but led the league in receiving touchdowns; the source notes this creates a valuation puzzle—the Rams offense is expected to be elite, which should support touchdown upside, but Adams is 34 years old and showed age on vertical routes last year, struggling with high air-yard targets while excelling in red zone and goal-line work where the Rams leaned on him repeatedly.

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NegativeValue27:00

In PPR formats, the source would consider taking Adams in the fourth round of a 12-team draft given the Rams' offensive potential, though the decision depends on earlier picks; in standard leagues, he likely won't last that long. The core question is whether his 2024 touchdown total will recur given his age and declining vertical ability.

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DK Metcalf

NegativeRole17:27

Seahawks receiver mentioned as the clear lead receiver in the offense (Jackson Smith-Njigba reference suggests he is the primary target). Source notes that Torrey Horton and Rashid Shaheed are competing for secondary receiver roles behind Metcalf.

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Emanuel Wilson

NegativeValue12:00

Seahawks running back ranked in the 50s among RBs by the source, representing a late-round pick (14th round range). Wilson filled in for Josh Jacobs in Green Bay at times. Source notes he doesn't profile as a great athlete with significant upside. In the context of the Seahawks backfield, Wilson is one of several depth options behind Jadarian Price and Zach Charbonnet. Ben Gretsch notes that if Wilson doesn't receive much attention during training camp while Price dominates the conversation, it would suggest Price is the clear lead option. Wilson is unlikely to be drafted in most leagues and represents minimal draft capital risk.

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George Holani

NegativeRole14:30

Seahawks young in-house running back solution who has received positive buzz despite limited offensive production (primarily special teams and depth RB). Ben Gretsch expresses skepticism about whether the positive offseason talk is genuine or 'offseason fluff.' Gretsch suggests that if Helani stops receiving attention as training camp progresses and the focus shifts entirely to Jadarian Price, it would indicate Price is the clear lead option and Helani's buzz was merely promotional. Helani is unlikely to be drafted and represents a monitoring situation rather than a draft target.

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George Kittle

NegativeInjury43:02

The source is skeptical of optimism surrounding Kittle's return from a late-season Achilles tear, noting that while rehab reports will be positive, the real question is whether he can maintain his historical efficiency and explosiveness within a year of the injury. The source emphasizes that six to eight months removed from a January Achilles tear is not enough time to guarantee he'll have the quick-twitch ability and explosiveness that defined his elite production. The source is pessimistic enough to avoid drafting him despite ranking him TE12, and advises ignoring team optimism if you're skeptical about his ability to return to form.

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Jacoby Brissett

NegativeRole59:00

The source is tracking whether Jacoby Brissett will remain the Cardinals' starting quarterback or if Carson Beck will get significant playing time. Brissett has been seeking a new contract all offseason and the source is monitoring whether he will hold out into camp. The source notes that Brissett's willingness to stand in the pocket and throw the ball frequently (resulting in 50 more targets to McBride than any other tight end) is a key factor for the Cardinals' pass catchers. If Beck gets significant buzz and playing time, it would be negative for the passing game as young quarterbacks tend to hold the ball longer and take more sacks.

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Jadarian Price

NegativeRole11:18

Seahawks first-round pick (end of first round) competing for backfield work in a crowded situation. The source notes Price is a fascinating prospect who was the 1B backup to Jeremiah Love in college, effective as a kick returner and with the ball in his hands. Key question is whether Seahawks believe he can be a workhorse and get significant volume. Ben Gretsch notes that early work in training camp would be a positive signal, as young players typically earn more time as seasons progress. However, Gretsch is cautious about reading too much into team commentary, noting the Seahawks are coming off a Super Bowl championship and unlikely to say negative things about Price. The situation is complicated by Zach Charbonnet's ACL recovery (expected to extend into season), Emmanuel Wilson's presence (ranked 50s among RBs by source), and George Helani's recent positive buzz. Source expects Price to be drafted based on draft capital alone, but actual role clarity may not emerge until in-season.

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James Conner

NegativeDepth Chart50:00

The source notes that the Cardinals restructured Connor and is tracking whether he remains the lead back or is released/traded. If Connor is let go, the source believes it could impact another team's backfield, as he is a respected veteran around the league. The source is monitoring Cardinals camp to see if Connor retires or if the team moves him.

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Jeremiyah Love

NegativeProjection53:00

The source acknowledges the paradox of Love: drafted in the top five of the NFL draft but immediately depressed in fantasy rankings because he lands with the Cardinals, a team the market has decided is hopeless. The source notes that people are convinced the team will be terrible but also convinced Love is the greatest prospect ever. The source has Love ranked RB17 and is open to elevating him if he gets strong camp buzz, though acknowledges it may be unrealistic for him to generate that kind of hype while splitting reps with three other running backs. The source sees a world where strong intra-squad drills and controlled scrimmages could move Love's ADP into the second round.

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Jordan James

NegativeDepth Chart36:00

Jordan James played only three offensive snaps last year and did not get a touch in the regular season; he received six carries in garbage time during a 41-6 playoff loss to the Seahawks and caught one pass, totaling minimal exposure. The 49ers are discussing him as a potential number-two option, but his lack of receiving profile and minimal playing time make him an unreliable handcuff for McCaffrey.

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Kaelon Black

NegativeDepth Chart37:00

Kaelin Black was drafted in the second round (33rd overall) and is widely considered a reach and overdraft; his profile is not strong, and critically, he lacks a significant receiving profile—a major concern given that Christian McCaffrey is the preeminent receiving running back of his generation. If McCaffrey goes down, Black may not be able to replicate the passing-game work, making him an unreliable handcuff.

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Kyren Williams

PositiveValue33:00

The source is higher on Kyron Williams than Blake Corum for the Rams backfield; Kyron ran 350 routes last year (vs. Corum's 116), was meaningfully more efficient as a receiver (0.31 yards per route run for Corum vs. Kyron's superior efficiency), and is valued as a pass blocker. The source expects upward draft pressure on Corum due to positive camp buzz, but believes Kyron's receiving work and efficiency make him more valuable for fantasy.

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Marvin Harrison Jr.

NegativeProjection58:00

The source is skeptical of Marvin Harrison's ability to produce despite his high draft pedigree (15th overall two years ago). The source notes that Michael Wilson outproduced Harrison last year and that Harrison looks worse on film than even his stats suggest, with the source believing some of his production is forced to avoid looking completely bad. However, the source acknowledges uncertainty and leaves open the possibility that Harrison could eventually live up to his draft capital as he ages, though the source has a hard time seeing it. The source ranks Harrison and Wilson relatively close, leaning slightly toward Harrison but without strong conviction.

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Michael Wilson

PositiveProjection58:00

The source notes that Michael Wilson was simply better than Marvin Harrison last year, producing more despite Harrison's higher pedigree and injuries. Wilson had an 18-target game and two more 15-target games, and had a real connection with quarterback Kobe Brissett. The source ranks Wilson and Harrison relatively close but is leaning slightly toward Harrison, indicating Wilson is undervalued relative to his actual 2025 production. The source emphasizes that the QB-wide receiver connection is important and that Wilson's connection with Brissett is a positive factor.

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Mike Evans

NegativeRole41:00

Evans is a new addition to the 49ers receiver room; the source provides no specific analysis of his role or projection but notes the 49ers' general opacity regarding receiver usage and deployment.

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Rashid Shaheed

NegativeRole17:27

Seahawks receiver signed to a new contract in the offseason after limited production with Seattle following his trade from New Orleans. Source ranks him 63rd among receivers, slightly behind Torrey Horton (57th). Ben Gretsch notes that while he is not super optimistic on Shaheed, the Seahawks' decision to sign him to a new contract and find a real role for him suggests he will have a legitimate role in the offense. Gretsch references Mike Tomlin's quote about it being hard to board a moving train, noting the Seahawks went through the entire offseason and decided to invest in Shaheed. Source notes Shaheed did not run many crisp intermediate routes in New Orleans or early with Seattle, but he is an explosive player who could become a Jamison Williams-type if circumstances align. Source will need to monitor whether Shaheed emerges as the clear receiver or if Horton's health allows him to maintain his ranking advantage.

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Ricky Pearsall

PositiveValue42:32

The source notes Pearsall had a much more interesting year two than his zero-touchdown stat line suggests; his ADOT was higher, targets per route run were higher, and he was earning more volume at deeper depth with more room for yardage. His yards per target and yards per route run both increased by more than half a yard, indicating a breakout trajectory before injury. The source is optimistic on him as a value if he gets a quiet August with no injury drama, believing people will be hoodwinked by bad stats and a frustrating season.

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PositiveProjection44:00

Pearsall has looked very good when healthy but has struggled with availability over two years; the source cautions against overreacting to his zero touchdowns last year, noting that fantasy analysts tend to overweight single-season touchdown totals (similar to the Devante Adams discussion), and expects positive camp chatter without major role changes.

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Terrance Ferguson

PositiveSleeper4:24

Second-year Rams tight end ranked 19th at the position by the source; currently ranked as a super-deep sleeper due to impressive film despite minimal usage (12 catches as a rookie, 11 regular season). Ferguson displayed elite playmaking ability on tape: Week 10 vs. 49ers, he motioned from slot, beat LB Luke Gifford with a post-fake and shove, creating separation for a 32-yard gain; Week 16 vs. Seahawks, he cut upfield against LB Drake Thomas for a 27-yard gain; Week 17 vs. Falcons, he beat safety Xavier Watts on a hitch-and-go for a 27-yard over-the-shoulder grab. Half his catches were 20+ air yards. The source notes Ferguson is fast and shifty at the top of routes, and on film looked comparable to Puka Nakua. Role change would be required for fantasy relevance given Colby Parkinson (8 TDs), Tyler Higbee, and second-round pick Max Clair also on roster; however, the source suggests Ferguson may function as a slot receiver rather than traditional tight end, potentially reducing 13-personnel usage. Source will monitor September developments closely.

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PositiveSleeper29:00

Ferguson is a second-year tight end with strong rookie efficiency (high aDOT, strong yardage-TD efficiency on 12 catches) who the source ranks inside the top 20 tight ends despite limited volume; the Rams have a history of using August buzz to signal real role changes (Kyron Williams, Blake Corum), and Ferguson could emerge as a matchup piece in 13 personnel packages if he gets camp buzz, making him a late-round target with potential year-two breakout upside.

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Tory Horton

PositiveBreakout20:57

The source describes Horton as an explosive player who runs crisp intermediate routes and has the potential to become a Jamison Williams-type playmaker if healthy; however, health status remains unclear and secretive, which could significantly impact his upside.

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Trey Benson

PositiveValue50:00

The source is most interested in tracking Benson's situation in Cardinals camp, noting he was starting to earn more work from Connor before Connor's injury and was efficient when given opportunities. Benson had a 5.5 yards per carry rate last year with interesting peripherals including evasion rate and yards after contact in year two. The source believes if Benson is traded or released, he could be pretty interesting in a different backfield, and is tracking whether the Cardinals keep all four running backs or move him elsewhere.

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Trey McBride

PositiveUsage59:00

The source notes that Trey McBride had 50 more targets than any other tight end last year, indicating absurd target volume. This volume was driven by Kobe Brissett's willingness to throw the ball frequently from the pocket. The source emphasizes that if Brissett remains the quarterback, McBride will continue to benefit from high target volume and optimism, but if Carson Beck gets significant playing time, it could be negative for McBride's production as young quarterbacks tend to hold the ball longer and take more sacks.

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Zach Charbonnet

NegativeInjury15:24

Seahawks running back dealing with late-season ACL tear that is expected to extend into the 2026 season. Ben Gretsch notes the rehab timeline is very late and suggests the injury recovery may carry into the regular season. Charbonnet's availability and role clarity are key variables in the Seahawks backfield situation, though his recovery status could change during training camp.

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Full transcript

Episode Transcript

749
0:00It's the Harris Fantasy Football Podcast with your host, Christopher Harris.
0:03Welcome! Hey everybody, welcome in. My name is Chris and this is a show about life on Earth.
0:09Hello there everybody. Thank you so much for listening.
0:12Great to be with you here today. Want to say hello to Jonathan C.
0:16in Indiana. I'm sorry it's taken me so long to say hello, get to your lovely email.
0:22Congrats so much on the toddler girly. I certainly am thinking of you and thinking wonderful thoughts.
0:27I hope she enjoys in some small way the yelling loon on this little podcast that could.
0:32And folks, we're less than two weeks from the start of August.
0:36Less than two weeks from going back to five shows per week.
0:40Less than two weeks from Almanac Day. With the goal overall, you know, around here trying to provide you with a different
0:47kind of voice when it comes to the NFL.
0:49I'm just not out here trying to predict the season.
0:53I think we're really bad at that beforehand. We, of course, all have ideas about the offenses that are going to be
0:59great, the teams that are going to be awesome, the ones that are going to stink.
1:04And if we were good at predicting those things, we'd all probably live in bigger houses or yachts than we currently do.
1:11I just like this morning put a point on this notion that we should be judging the quality of the NFL players
1:18individual seasons to be in 2026 by what, for example, the Vegas sports books think of them.
1:24I just did a spreadsheet exercise before I hit record just to take a quick spin through 2025.
1:29How many teams do you think finished within one game of their projected season win total last year?
1:35That would be nine, nine out of 32 teams.
1:38How many finished within two games of their projected season win total last year?
1:42That would be 17, which means 15 out of the 32 teams were off by two and a half wins or more.
1:4910 out of 32 teams were off by three and a half wins or more.
1:54That's fairly unbelievable. The Chiefs and Ravens, the Bengals and Cardinals and Commanders and Raiders, all teams and in some cases offenses
2:01that, you know, everyone was trying to sell you players off of because, you know, they're either going to be the best
2:07teams in the league or pretty darn good. And for various reasons, like we know the reasons, those definitely did not have good fantasy players on them.
2:16A lot of them. The Patriots and Seahawks, the Super Bowl participants had over under totals of eight and a half.
2:22The Broncos and Jags playoff teams were nine and a half and seven and a half and finished 14 and 13.
2:29And not every unexpectedly good team had this like unexpected offensive wagon that made everyone fantasy relevant either.
2:35But the point is, I hear about how people talk about this league and it's everywhere.
2:40It's about to be absolutely everywhere. That's all it's going to be in the shouty shows on McAfee.
2:45That's all you're going to get is is everybody who's sure.
2:49And when the league, what is it? More than one third of the league is off by three and a half wins.
2:56There's just a lot of things that we that are going to happen with these teams that we just don't know.
3:02And so I say all this. If you can somehow try to carve up the evaluation pie when you're thinking about individual
3:09players, you might want to draft for fantasy. If you can make the sliver of the pie that represents their situation, what
3:16you project for their offense, if you can make that as small as you possibly can, not make it zero.
3:22You're not made of stone. But try not to rule out guys because they're definitely on hopeless teams.
3:28Try not to go wild for a player you don't love because you're positive the team's going to be a wagon.
3:34That's what we're trying to preach around here. And we'll continue to do so for the next couple weeks part time and
3:41then starting on August 3rd full time. Okay. And so we do have an almanac coming out.
3:47And when I say we, I mean I. I'm the one who made it.
3:51The 3rd of August. It's two weeks from yesterday.
3:54You can preorder it right now. I said this on the Yacht Club yesterday.
3:58If you only have room for one Harris related purchase this summer, I'm also going to have a novel coming out.
4:05You'll be able to preorder the novel pretty soon.
4:08It's called Pound Foolish. You know, I worked for a couple months on the almanac.
4:12I haven't put a book out since 2018. So if you only had the luxury of buying one football related thing from
4:19me this summer, I would prefer the book. But anyway, if you can do both, that's incredible.
4:24Uh, let's read an almanac player profile here from a team in the NFC West.
4:29Since we're going to talk NFC West on today's show.
4:32Let's do Terrence Ferguson. Second year Rams tight end.
4:35I don't think we're going to do a lot of Terrence Ferguson talk in the meat of today's show or most of
4:42the topics that we do in August. Because while I'm going to say nice things about him, I'm still only ranking him
4:49right now as the number 19 tight end for fantasy.
4:52But I can say like, I've got part of the super deeper, super deep sleeper list worked out because after watching his
4:59film this summer, I think that's where he's going to land.
5:02Terrence Ferguson's profile goes like this. For a guy who caught 12 catches as a rookie, 11 in the regular season, one
5:09in the playoffs, Ferguson left an impression on me.
5:12Obviously it would take a role change for him to become must own in fantasy.
5:17And I'll talk about that in a minute. But what I'd like to mention first is this kid, lightly used as he was, looked like a stud playmaker.
5:26It takes a few minutes to watch that paltry number of catches.
5:29And if you have the means, I urge you to do it.
5:33You'll come away smiling. I don't know Sean McVay and I don't correctly predict everything he'll do.
5:38But the way he used Ferguson in 2025 looked very much like a feet getting wet scenario in preparation for something bigger.
5:45This kid is fast and he's really shifty at the top of a route.
5:50I'll direct you to a few of his catches.
5:52Week 10 against the Niners, Ferguson goes in motion and gets matched out of the slot against linebacker Luke Gifford.
5:59And oh my word, does Ferguson put Gifford in the torture chamber.
6:02He fakes like he's going to the post, shoves the 243 pound Gifford away like it's nothing, breaks out, then turns up
6:09the field with acres of separation, making Gifford look foolish for a 32-yard gain.
6:14Week 16 against the Seahawks, Ferguson is in the slot.
6:17Puka Nakua runs a clear out and it looks like a screen, but Ferguson puts his foot in the ground and cuts
6:24upfield and linebacker Drake Thomas is dead. Ferguson creates five yards of space downfield for a 27-yard gain.
6:29In week 17 against the Falcons, Ferguson is slot left.
6:33Safety Xavier Watts is in man. Ferguson does a little hitch and go.
6:37Again, dusted and over-the-shoulder grab for 27 yards. A full half of his catches were thrown 20-plus air yards.
6:43Famously, McVay has resurrected 13 personnel, which means three tight ends on the field at the same time.
6:48In theory, that makes it tough for Ferguson to grab a consistent roll when Colby Parkinson is scoring eight touchdowns and Tyler
6:55Higbee is around and the Rams also drafted Max Clare in the second round of April's draft.
7:00That's why I'm not ranking Ferguson anywhere near fantasy starterhood.
7:04But I'm telling you, there were times on film I had a hard time telling him apart from Nakua.
7:09It was an incredibly small sample size. But Ferguson looks so much different from all those other Rams tight ends that I
7:16think you could argue maybe the Rams aren't in 13 much at all because, in fact, Ferguson is a slot receiver.
7:23If things bend in his favor in September, I'll be ready to pounce.
7:27Okay, that's a slightly shorter profile because it comes a little later in the book.
7:32But as I say, he's number 19 on the tight end list.
7:35The Rams have so many guys. It's hard to get aggressive on him.
7:40But the value in going through the exercise of watching all that tape and writing all those profiles, I think it's like
7:46233 profiles this year coming out August 3rd. You know, if you do that, you do develop opinions that I think aren't
7:53going to be wildly common on some players. Maybe differentiates your fantasy strategy as you head into your draft in August.
8:00And so, yes, if you would like to pre-order to get ready for August 3rd, you can do it right now at harrisfootball.com.
8:07Today's kickoff. Okay, on today's show, we're in the second half of July.
8:11We're on the fifth of eight training camp previews.
8:14We go division by division. Today, it'll be the teams of the NFC West.
8:18A lot of big players in this division. A lot of noise we shouldn't pay attention to in August.
8:24But some stuff we should with the Seahawks, Rams, 49ers, and Cardinals to help sort through it.
8:30Ben Gretsch from the Stealing Signals newsletter will join.
8:32I think it'll be pretty darn fun, and I thank you again so much for listening today.
8:38We have a new sponsor. It came along at a good time for me.
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9:4325% off with code Harris. Cowboycolostrum.com slash Harris. Today's guest.
9:47And today's guest. It is Ben Gretsch. As I mentioned, from the Stealing Signals newsletter, you can find Ben all over social media.
9:54Just look up Ben Gretsch wherever you are. I'm sure he's there too.
9:58And subscribe to Stealing Signals because it's really good and because you'll learn a lot.
10:03Hello, Ben. How are you? Good. Glad to be back with you.
10:06Excited to talk as we enter training camp about what's coming.
10:10Yeah, man. You've done this show before. You've received your relatively new recipient of the fascist email with all the bolding and underlining.
10:17But you know the deal. Well, we're looking for kind of click discipline.
10:21The goal around here is to try and react as little as possible.
10:25To be take committed as much as possible. But then also on certain situations, a little bit more flexible.
10:31So we're kind of under the umbrella of previewing training camps.
10:34We're talking NFC West. And we'll start with a team you know a little something about.
10:39And that team kicked my team's tuchus in the Super Bowl and made me cry at night, all night.
10:45It is the Seattle Seahawks. First of all, congratulations.
10:48Yeah. I mean, all the people around me very excited.
10:51I actually grew up a Vikings fan, even though I live in Seattle.
10:55But I know you're a Vikings fan. That's the bit, baby.
10:59That's right. It's been fun to see the excitement in the city and all of that.
11:04People are pretty thrilled. It's always kind of funny because I'm like, I'm a suffering Mariners fan.
11:09And I was a Sonics fan growing up. And they don't exist anymore.
11:13And Vikings don't win anything. And I'm a huge Washington Huskies fan.
11:17And they made the national championship a couple years ago and lost.
11:21None of my teams have ever actually won a title.
11:24So it's not great. Yeah, man. I, of course, know that you live in Seattle.
11:29I, of course, also know that you're not a Seahawks fan.
11:32That's the case. So, OK, the backfield for Seattle, obviously a very big story, you know, from the question of whether Zach
11:39Charbonnet plays all year and certainly does anything in training camp and whether that changes our perceptions and or ranks.
11:45That's feels like it's obvious. You know, if suddenly we get miracle recovery out of Charbonnet, Sabcav, Zach Charbonnet, we'll change probably a bunch of things in ranks.
11:54But then also just there are, as I've been saying, like forking paths of information where depending on how the team talks
12:01about Jadarian Price and how they talk about Emmanuel Wilson, who was the, you know, cheap free agent signing and how they
12:08talk about George Helani, who's the young in-house solution before Price.
12:11There's just a lot of different ways. I know, obviously, it's a situation where we're going to be monitoring almost every day.
12:18What are the kinds of things you specifically will allow yourself to be swayed by?
12:23Yeah, I mean, I think generally this question is often about the younger players and because we have such little information about
12:30them and then the positions that are more volume dependent, I'm pretty interested in hearing about.
12:35So Jadarian Price makes a lot of sense to this point.
12:38I mean, I think anything that points at early work is probably a pretty clear positive since we tend to expect young
12:45players to kind of earn more time as seasons progress.
12:48They obviously took him at the end of the first round.
12:52He's a fascinating guy because he was the, you know, sort of the backup to Jeremiah Love, you know, 1B, however you
12:58want to put that, really effective kick returner and, you know, good in little ways like that with the ball in his hands.
13:06But I want to know if they think he can be a workhorse, if they think he can get a ton of work.
13:13How do we make that determination based on sunshine that emanates from people's mouths who work for teams?
13:18What's the process by which you start to believe the, you know, I really find it hard to believe unless he gets
13:25hurt that the Seahawks coaches are going to say bad things about Jadarian Price.
13:30It's possible they say, you know, just not ready.
13:33We don't think he's going to play any third downs.
13:36There is a world for that to maybe have a tinge of like reading between the lines.
13:41But given, you know, if we don't get that, how do you like what do you need to be hearing out of the team and or beat reporters?
13:50Yeah, and I think, you know, this is one of those ones.
13:54I know you lean more toward a lot of the stuff is going to be not super helpful.
13:59And I am on the same way. I think we have to deal with a lot of uncertainty in fantasy.
14:05And I love this idea of, you know, having the discipline of our takes because the pricing probably is something that occurs more in season.
14:13So in terms of your question, I don't know that there's a clear answer.
14:18This is, you know, as we go through this division, there's a couple that I'm really kind of interesting or interested in.
14:25This is one that I'm maybe not so interested in.
14:28They kind of have things set up. They're coming off a Super Bowl championship.
14:32I doubt they're going to say a whole lot.
14:35Like you said, I mean, I think people are going to overact to overreact.
14:39To what does come out. The one guy that might be interesting here is George Helani has gotten a lot of positive
14:46buzz, even though he hasn't really done a lot on offense throughout his career.
14:51He's basically been kind of a special teams guy or depth running back.
14:55The fact that they talked about him so much.
14:57I've wondered as sort of if it's sort of offseason fluff.
15:01And if we get into August and we kind of stop hearing about him and everything's about price, that would be maybe
15:08more of an indication because you're right. They're going to say positive about price.
15:12But if we stop hearing about him and we haven't heard as much about Emmanuel Wilson as I expected, he did a
15:19good job of filling in for Josh Jacobs in Green Bay at times.
15:23But if we're not hearing about those other guys much and it's all price all the time.
15:28And as you know, to Charbonneau, obviously a key part of this as well.
15:33But his rehab, you know, very late ACL tear seems like it's going to go into the season a little bit.
15:39But we could hear something different on that. But if we're not hearing about the other guys as much, that might be
15:46the way that I would would try to frame it.
15:49Yeah. Try to frame prices, potential reliability, ascension or whatever.
15:52Yeah, it's a it's a tough one. I guess the good news.
15:56I mean, price is the one who's going to cost anything in a fantasy league because, you know, your aunt and my
16:03cousin are going to know that he went at the end of the first round and they wouldn't have spent that pick
16:10if they didn't plan on beating him like a rented mule, which isn't always true.
16:15But, you know, that's certainly going to be the perception.
16:18And so there's really outside of injury, nothing probably that can happen in that backfield that's going to like shuffle the way they're getting drafted.
16:26Um, Holani probably won't get drafted. Emmanuel Wilson, I have ranked in the, you know, 50s among running backs.
16:32You could argue that's a late round pick. You could argue it's kind of an exciting late round, you know, 14th round pick.
16:39If you're looking for upside, maybe Emmanuel Wilson doesn't profile as a great athlete who has a ton of upside.
16:45Um, so you're right. A lot of this is just about, okay, how over their skis do you think the common folks
16:52will be in everybody listening's drafts over Jadarian Price?
16:55And I guess the one good thing you'd say is that probably, whereas, you know, Jeremiah Love, the temptation is going to
17:02be for the market to go, we have to make him a top 10 fantasy running back for drafts.
17:08And you have to, we have to talk about really investing mass.
17:11We'll talk about him later. I doubt, I doubt we're going to get that level of excitement on Jadarian Price to get
17:18him in a place where if you took a pick, if you took a stab on him in the whatever, fifth round
17:25or sixth round, you're probably not going to, if it doesn't work out, you're not going to ruin your draft.
17:31Right. Yeah. No, absolutely. Okay. Sorry. Sorry. That was a little speech.
17:35No, I mean, it wasn't really much of a question.
17:38You're right about that. We're getting out of the other guys, but you're right.
17:43I kind of don't think my price rank is going to change that much at receiver for the Seahawks.
17:49In the abstract, I keep telling people how much I like Torrey Horton.
17:53It's me and Chris Collingsworth at that one commander's game last year when Horton scored the great touchdown and then immediately got
18:00hurt and was out for the season. Raving. What a route runner.
18:03You know, there's a question of his health. I, you know, I currently have Torrey Horton ranked a little bit ahead of
18:10Rashid Shaheed, the rural juror part two. Um, I guess like, are you receptive at all to news about either one of
18:17those guys behind Jackson Smith and Ajigba? I think that's, um, a fun ranking.
18:21I think Torrey Horton's a really interesting prospect, um, had five touchdowns last year on 13 catches, you know, 22 targets.
18:28I mean, a crazy efficient, um, touchdown rate. And it seemed like he was really starting to come on in his rookie
18:35year, an example of one of those guys that maybe would have been doing more later in his rookie year as he
18:42was starting to really build out his role and carve out his spot in the offense.
18:47And then he got hurt as he noted. Uh, yeah, I'm, I'm definitely open to, to positive Horton news.
18:53She, he did really not much with Seattle after coming over.
18:56Um, I do, I was thinking back to that old Mike Tomlin quote that it's hard to board a moving train and
19:03they were kind of where they were. And the fact that they went through the whole off season and decided they wanted
19:10to sign him to a new contract and find a real role for him and maybe build the off season stuff.
19:17I'm, I'm not like super optimistic on Shahid, but I do think he's probably going to have a real role.
19:23And, and so in terms of how that would affect my, my August stuff, I don't think there's a lot that's going
19:30to change sort of my read on this at all.
19:33I, I, um, I think it's a little tricky for Horton to get the full-time routes and stuff, unless you're pretty down on Shahid.
19:40And I don't think like a negative report or something would, would necessarily change that.
19:45Uh, I do think he's a really fun upside player.
19:48So that's, um, yeah, I'm excited about that. I guess he makes my list as somebody that I will pay attention to
19:55because I'm kind of in the bag for him a little bit Horton.
19:59That is, um, I'm not trying, you know, I'm, I'm trying to pick one of these Seattle receivers, maybe on some teams in the double digit rounds.
20:08I'm, you know, what's the number? I think I'm 57 among receivers on Horton 63 on Shahid.
20:13This is not me sticking my neck way out, but Horton, like there's, I think he still might not have a clean bill of health going into camp.
20:22He had some kind of surgery on something, um, like he had a fractured shin originally.
20:27Um, but it's unclear. Like as of, I don't, as of right now, I don't know.
20:32Did he have the surgery on the leg? Did he have it on his groin?
20:36Do you know? I actually don't. I don't think they've said, yeah, I don't, I don't think we could, we could know.
20:43So there is just a possibility that, um, I need to pay attention because I need to stop boosting Tori Horton artificially
20:50and realize that Rashid, and Shahid while, you know, I still don't feel like I've seen Shahid in the saints days or
20:57certainly not coming over from, uh, to Seattle, like really run a lot of good crisp intermediate routes.
21:03Um, he's a explosive player and in the right world can run right past Tori Horton and become the, the Jamison Williams
21:10type who just makes a whole bunch of plays.
21:12And suddenly why, why is he watching for 18?
21:15How's this happening? Like, I'm going to need to switch these guys.
21:19If Horton isn't healthy. Yeah. The health stuff. I I'm, I'm like trying to look it up as we're talking and I'm
21:26seeing stuff that's like, why, why are they being so secretive on that?
21:30It has been very unclear. So yeah, I mean, certainly if we got some, some poor health information that would, that would have to change the Horton optimism.
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22:12We are back with Ben and we're talking about training camps for these teams in the NFC West.
22:18We're on to maybe the most settled seeming skill group in the NFL.
22:22I say seeming because we're always wrong, but we think the Rams have kind of like settled their, their thing.
22:28Would you agree that maybe, maybe not in your mind, but that kind of in the football world's mind after this absolutely
22:35not being the case last summer, this summer, the Rams then kind of are the one that everybody's the most positive will be a wagon offensively.
22:43Yeah. I mean, there's a lot going for them.
22:46I mean, you said offensively, obviously the miles Garrett acquisition.
22:49Also, I think people are definitely high on their hands.
22:53Yeah. And you know, last summer, Matthew Stafford's back injury was going to bleed into the season and ruin any chance of all those guys being good.
23:01And isn't it funny how, isn't it funny how quickly we, we just move on from that stuff.
23:07I mean, last year, Chris Alave was never going to play again because of concussions.
23:11And no one's talking about that this year. Matthew Stafford was going to have to retire.
23:16He literally couldn't throw. I remember people with panicked social media posts.
23:20This is a debilitating injury. He's never going to be the same again.
23:24Wins the MVP. And now we're just, he has no injury issues at his age.
23:29Yeah. We're just positive that they're going to be really good.
23:32And I gave a little talk at the beginning of the show in which, you know, it's kind of the message is
23:39kind of like things are never as good or as bad as they seem.
23:44Things are never, you know, like we shouldn't, if I'll put it this way, we can have kind of a, let's have
23:50a meta conversation about Devante Adams because it's so fascinating.
23:54I think everybody watching Rams film last year knows that Devante Adams was probably a lesser version of himself, but the things
24:00he still did well, obviously the Rams take took unbelievable advantage of.
24:04He's still incredibly dangerous in a, in a phone booth and in the red zone, they just leaned on him again and again.
24:11He scores a million touchdowns. And like if those touchdowns are there for him again, he's once again, going to perform unbelievably
24:18well, but I don't think I, I don't think I or you were probably most people are ranking him as though last year's finish is likely to recur.
24:27And yet we're all like so convinced about the Rams offense being good.
24:31So why shouldn't he score a bunch of touchdowns?
24:34You know, it becomes this dance of like, we're, we're like pretending one way or the other on Adams.
24:40That's a great, yeah, it's a, it's a great way of putting it.
24:44I, then there was a little bit of talk of, you know, potential trade and it seemed like, like you said, they,
24:51the, the, the red zone stuff and the goal line stuff went exactly to plan and he was incredible.
24:57They also threw downfield to him a lot. The air yards, the high a dot stuff.
25:02Um, and he was like pretty poor on that stuff.
25:05You could see the age on anything where they, I think we're trying to get a vertical role out of him that
25:12would open up, you know, some of the shortened intermediate stuff for Nakua.
25:16And he, that's like you said, I mean, when I was watching it, my takeaway was he does, he's not a good
25:23fit for what they are trying to get out of him, you know, in this particular role, um, had one of his
25:30worst yardage seasons, you know, I guess since the, the early years, cause he had a couple of really poor years to
25:37start his career, but it's been years and years since he was as low as he was last year in yardage.
25:43But as you noted, I mean, he leads the league in receiving TDs to really fascinating profile.
25:48Yeah. I'm, I'm looking, speaking of profile, I'm looking at what I wrote for him from the Almanac and like in 2025
25:55before that season in his profile, I said, can you envision a pretty clear path for a wide receiver to maybe reach double digit, double digit touchdowns?
26:04Congratulations. He's in the top 20 and like way to undersell it.
26:08He finished wide receiver seven and he did it with under 800 yards receiving.
26:12Yeah. It's crazy. And, and yet, because we are like the Rams are going to be on everybody's list of offenses that
26:19you're pretty darn sure that if everybody stays healthy, they're going to score 30 points a game.
26:24I mean, you know, can, can you with a straight, I don't want to ask this as a rhetorical question.
26:30Can you look your readers in the eye and your listeners in the eye and tell them not to take Adams at any price?
26:38Like he's 34, man. You got to get out of it.
26:41Like I can't do it. I'm, I'm maybe a little bit more skeptical because like, I think maybe I can.
26:48And I do think the touchdowns could definitely be there.
26:51I'm not, I'm not saying to not take him at any price.
26:55I think the whole conversation is like, do you think he's going to score that many touchdowns again?
27:00I mean, that's the way I wrote it up was like straight up.
27:04Do you think, you know, do you want to bet on that again?
27:08But the, the age and stuff, I'm, it, it scares me.
27:12I always liked the younger guys as we, as we've talked about before.
27:16Well, fair. Yeah, that is fair. I mean, so like in a standard league, I think if, you know, you get to
27:23the fourth, fourth round, is it going to last that long?
27:26I don't know. In PPR, it's yeah, probably, probably, I would probably be willing to take the shot because the Rams offense
27:33has the potential to be so extraordinary that if it's the fourth round of a 12 team draft, I would, it would
27:40depend on what else I did and the first three picks, but I could see myself doing it.
27:46I don't know if that's how drafts will work out because he was the wide receiver seven.
27:51Yeah. It's a great point about a standard as well, or, or like a half PPR versus a full PPR.
27:57I mean, I think it's going to be very different for him, but to the point about like what news from the Rams might be interesting.
28:05I mean, this is a team that they've had some, some big August buzz in recent years, like that have worked out,
28:12like Puka Nakua was getting a lot of August buzz.
28:15This is one of the teams in the NFL where maybe I'm most interested to hear about the young players.
28:22The year that Kyron took over for cam acres, we were hearing all about this Kyron Williams guy, this young guy.
28:28And I think, you know, cam acres for a lot of people was, he was going higher in drafts and was expected to be the lead back.
28:37But Kyron kind of took over that role by like week two.
28:40And so this is a team. And then they've done some weird things with usage where like Blake Corum last year, he
28:47went from basically no rookie work to a real year to roll.
28:51And so I am looking at some of the young guys on this team.
28:55And you mentioned Adams, one of the guys I'm interested in is the second year tight end Terrence Ferguson, because he had
29:02a really high eight for a tight end. He had some strong yardage TD efficiency as a rookie.
29:08They've talked a little bit about him knowing the wide receiver positions, which is usually just kind of buzz that they do.
29:15But, you know, they like to do the heavy personnel and like the 13 personnel and then flex out the tight ends
29:22when they get the right defensive personnel, get the defense and base and all of those things.
29:27And so Ferguson to me is one I'm definitely keeping my ear open for a lot of hype and buzz because he's
29:34this late round tight end where they may see him as a real matchup piece going into year two, like the Kyron
29:41stuff, like the Blake Corum stuff where they didn't necessarily use him.
29:44It's kind of got hurt a little in his rookie year, but they didn't necessarily use him a bunch.
29:50But then they had this big role plan for him in year two.
29:54And we just kind of learned that in the regular season.
29:58So he's what I'm keeping a little bit of an ear open.
30:02If Adams can't do some of the vertical stuff from last year, then that's kind of one of the guys that I
30:09think might have the potential for some upside or if there's maybe a wide receiver they're talking about.
30:14I mean, they have a bunch of like random young receivers that don't look that interesting to me.
30:20That's why I kind of zero in on Ferguson.
30:23But yeah, this is a team where like a little bit of August buzz has sometimes signaled a real role in season,
30:30maybe more than any of the other 31 teams.
30:32So that sound you heard, Ben, was America's eyes rolling back in their heads because you don't know this.
30:38You don't know this, but I read Terrence Ferguson's profile off the top of the show for specifically this exact reason that I mean, it was 12 catches.
30:47So you got to like, I got to check myself, but I love the tape so much.
30:52He looks like a freak on those catches. I can't get him.
30:56You know, he's inside my top 20 tight ends, but you're not you're not drafting tight end number 19.
31:02I don't want you to draft two tight ends in a standard league.
31:06So it's like hard to say, oh, he's a must draft after, you know, nine catches, you know, like a kid, but,
31:13but a hundred percent, like I, I'm susceptible to camp buzz on him.
31:17Absolutely. I love it. I love hearing you say that.
31:20As far as the Kyron Corum share goes, I can't imagine a world that we come out of Rams camp thinking, wow.
31:27Wow. The Rams have made it really clear that Blake Corum is going back to some subservient role.
31:33Like, no, they're going to the whole storyline. The whole time is going to be, we got two guys.
31:39This is unbelievable. We're a wagon. And so probably nothing's going to change.
31:43I don't know. I don't want, let me ask it.
31:46Bearing an injury, is anything going to change in the way you're regarding those two Rams running backs?
31:52Probably not. Yeah. So like me too. And so wherever kind of, you know, wherever we're recommending people take them, we're recommending people take them.
31:59I think I'm higher on Kyron Williams. I've been told I'm, I don't really look at ADP this time of year, but like, give me a few weeks.
32:08I will. And I think I'm told I'm higher on Kyron because other people are more scared of Corum than I am.
32:15And they're allowed to be. I don't know what's going to, I can't see the future.
32:20I don't know if it's a 50, 50 split.
32:23I've probably biffed it a little bit. My tendencies think it won't be.
32:27And that in most running back NFL backfields, there's usually another guy and it can be a little frustrating week to week.
32:34I remember a Europe game last year where Tyler Algier scored a couple touchdowns and the John Robinson people lost their minds.
32:41Like this happens. But given that we're not going to change our minds, I think probably like the upward pressure that people
32:48are going to feel is going to be for Corum because nice things are going to be said about him.
32:54Right? Yeah, probably. I guess the one thing that would be interesting to me on Corum would be receiving work because last year, Kyron got all of it.
33:03Like they split the carries, but Kyron plays a lot more.
33:06And I mean, Kyron is always kind of under fire, but he's had 250 plus PPR points three straight years.
33:12But Corum last year only ran 116 routes and his yards per hour run was 0.31, which is really poor.
33:19I don't expect people to know the scales or anything, but certainly not an efficient receiver in the limited work that he got.
33:26Whereas Kyron ran more than three times as many routes.
33:29He had 350 routes and was meaningfully more efficient.
33:32And they like him as a pass blocker. And he's sort of the veteran and those things.
33:37If they start talking a ton and it's just like this heavy drum beat that Blake Corum's going to play more on
33:44passing downs, maybe I'll be more concerned about the split for Kyron.
33:48But I do think Kyron is meaningfully more valuable for fantasy because the receiving stuff's pretty important and he seems to really have that.
33:55And I guess I don't see any kind of conversation in August that's going to convince me that, you know, after Blake
34:02Corum had a really poor year on a very limited receiving role, he's going to suddenly have a ton more work.
34:09I mean, I guess the other thing would be if Jack was Hunter as another year two guy, kind of like the
34:16Ferguson stuff suddenly got a bunch of buzz. I don't think he had an interesting profile to me.
34:21He didn't play at all as a rookie and I don't think there's a lot of room for him, but we just
34:28saw Corum go from a very limited rookie role to a big year two role.
34:33And, you know, maybe they were really holding Jack was Hunter back because of an organizational philosophy that the rookies aren't ready or something.
34:40So if he started to get a bunch of buzz, oh, it's going to be a three headed committee like, yeah, that may change my opinion as well.
34:49But I mean, short of a bunch of Corum receiving optimism or a bunch of optimism from guys further down like a Jack was Hunter.
34:57I just yeah, I think the Kyron and Corum thing is going to be kind of what your offseason research tells you it's going to be.
35:05I like it. I like I think you're right in both counts.
35:09To be honest, it's tough to know what's believable when it comes to Corum receiving work.
35:14It might be the kind of thing that we, you know, get get whiffs of.
35:18But then suddenly week one, week two happened. We're like, oh, you know, that's a big change.
35:24So but it's worth it's worth taking a look at.
35:27I agree. And of course, because it's the offense everyone agrees is definitely the best in the league.
35:33It matters. And both guys, both both of those running backs, not Hunter, but the other two are going to get drafted for sure.
35:40Just a matter of where the 49ers. Yay. Let's spend another summer obsessing over who Christian McCaffrey's backup is.
35:46Yep. The 49ers are not going to tell you they're not going to let it slip.
35:51You want to talk about an opaque box? We are not going to.
35:55I mean, maybe we will. I don't it's I don't really I don't I don't really think we're going to get that information.
36:02It's a bunch of bodies that everybody's kind of like surprise.
36:06Really? Kaelin Black. OK, maybe. I don't know. It matters very much.
36:09I would love to have a clear handcuff if I took McCaffrey in the first round.
36:14It's a massive risk just because last year went well doesn't mean this year will go well.
36:20What's your level of confidence that you'll have a great answer about handcuffable players to McCaffrey by the end of August?
36:26It's extremely low. My level of confidence is this is feels like a complete coin flip.
36:31We learned nothing about Jordan James last year. He played three offensive snaps and didn't get a touch in the regular season.
36:38They gave him a few touches in that blowout 41 to 6 playoff loss to the Seahawks.
36:44That was it. I mean, that was his whole season.
36:47He got, you know, six carries in garbage time and caught one pass.
36:51Didn't touch the ball all season. And they're talking about him like he might be the number two.
36:56And then they go draft Kaelin Black, who everyone is saying was a huge reach and overdrafted.
37:02And the profile is not great. And I mean, one of the things is neither of these guys necessarily has a huge receiving profile.
37:09And Christian McCaffrey is the preeminent receiving running back of our whole generation.
37:13And when he got hurt two years ago, Jordan Mason didn't do as much as a receiver.
37:19Maybe if again, to get to the sort of the receiving stuff, if we start hearing that Kaelin Black or Jordan James
37:26is, you know, running the Christian McCaffrey playbook in camp or something, he's running a lot of routes.
37:31And he's going to be the guy that if McCaffrey goes down, that they can do some of the stuff in the passing game with.
37:39But to me, it seems like it would be a Jordan Mason situation where if McCaffrey went down, we're not even going
37:46to get they're going to have a different playbook.
37:49We're not going to get the receiving stuff. And to your point, this is not a team that's going to tell you.
37:56I don't have any optimism at all that we're going to learn anything about Kaelin Black or Jordan James.
38:02And I don't think we know anything coming in either.
38:05They both feel like total question marks. So it's I mean, it's he's a really old back and he led the league in touches last year.
38:13And it seems like an important conversation, but we don't know anything.
38:17We really don't. If you if you are someone who takes the plunge on McCaffrey mid first round, do you find yourself
38:23just saying, yeah, I'm going to have to live with the risk?
38:27There isn't an obvious handcuff. I'll do my best if and when there's a CMC injury.
38:32Or do you are you someone who tends to go belt and suspenders and says, you know what, in the 12th and
38:3913th round, I'm just going to take both of those guys.
38:43I tend to avoid the handcuff because if I'm making that pick in the first round, I kind of need McCaffrey specific skill set on the field.
38:51Like I don't I'm kind of feel like I'm making my bet.
38:55You know, you you're one person in a 10 team league or one person at 12 team league.
39:00You kind of need some things to go right to win anyway.
39:04Having said that, if you know, you just said the 12th and 13th, if that's the price I have to pay, I wouldn't do it.
39:12If these guys are cheap enough, if people are not really pushing them up and it's maybe a league with a little
39:19bit of a deeper bench, I could see very cheaply stashing them both.
39:23If like I said, if there's a lot, if there's depth on the bench and some flexibility to do that.
39:29But otherwise, I mean, if I'm making the McCaffrey bet, I'm probably we want to be confident in our first round picks.
39:36I'm probably making the McCaffrey bet, right? We're sponsored by Fitbod.
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40:47F-I-T-B-O-D dot M-E slash Harris. We're back with Ben and we've got more Niners talk and then some Cardinals talk.
40:54Receivers for the Niners. You've got Mike Evans as a new body with the 49ers.
40:58You've got Christian Kirk as a, you know, secondary body.
41:02Boy, you say secondary and then you remember what Houston was like in December and in the playoffs.
41:07You go, oh God, that's all I need. And then you've got the second round pick, Dejan Stribling.
41:13And you've got Ricky Pearsall, who I have felt like has looked very good when he's been healthy.
41:18Just hasn't been healthy much in two years. I, you know, again, we talked before the break about how the Niners are
41:25opaque when it comes to definitive statements about how they're going to use their players.
41:30I don't know. Do you, do you have anything?
41:33Do you have a spin on what you want to pay attention to in August that could influence how you're thinking about those players?
41:40I mean, maybe it was Stribling if we hear a lot about how he's going to play the Jawan Jennings role fully
41:47because it seems like they like his, his blocking and that's kind of how they, they view him is as a replacement for that Jennings role.
41:55Then I would be a little optimistic that, I mean, I think we should expect him to be on the field a little.
42:03He was another one where people think it was a little bit of a reach, I think, but he was the first pick of the second round.
42:11He was 33rd overall. I mean, they took him very high.
42:14He's got, you know, good ball and hand stuff on, on film and in his profile.
42:19And I think he's a limited player, but an interesting player.
42:23And so if they're talking about him being on the field, he's going really, really late.
42:28I would probably be pretty interested. Okay. And I, I would do on Pearsall.
42:32I thought he looked great, but I think people are sort of overreacting to the fact that he had zero touchdowns last year, which they always do.
42:41You know, we're talking about the other direction with Devonta Adams earlier.
42:44I'll probably listen on Pearsall too, but I don't, again, like you said, I don't know that we're going to get a
42:51ton on like a Ricky Pearsall other than your general, like positive stuff.
42:55Yeah. And then there's, you know, George Kittle, which I know you want to talk about too, but I thought we're going
43:02to learn anything more than optimism on him. We've been getting nothing but optimism.
43:07He's, he's going to be back. He's how will he play in week one?
43:11Will he not? Oh, now he's going to play in week one.
43:15He's going to travel to Australia. First, it was like, maybe he won't.
43:19And I mean, he tore his Achilles late in the year, so it's kind of like whatever you want to bet on
43:26with regards to this highly efficient player coming back from an Achilles injury.
43:30Will he be able to be that highly efficient player is, is more of an in-season question than how his rehab is going.
43:37They're telling, they're going to tell you he's looking great.
43:40And like, as you're talking about, we're not going to get any real substantive, substantive news on him either.
43:46Let's talk about them all together. Because when you're talk, when you talk about Evans and Kittle, you're talking about two of
43:53the great fantasy producers of the last decade. When you talk about Pearsall, you talk about somebody who on film, I think
44:00has looked really good, really wiggly, very fast. And was a first round pick.
44:04And then you've got Stripling as a second round pick.
44:07I mentioned Kirk as like, I think probably Kirk, in his best case, serves as an annoyance.
44:13It's not like I didn't write a profile for him in the top 80.
44:17He's not my top 80 receiver, so I'm not talking about him as a fantasy option, but like as a drain potentially.
44:24The annoying thing is going to be the way the Niners really aren't that believable.
44:29And it will be a whole, whole, whole bunch of sunshine.
44:32The sunshine to me on Pearsall will be maybe a little more believable.
44:36That just may be a predisposition. And it will not feel as believable because exactly as you said for Kittle, like rehab is one thing.
44:44But playing at the level with a torn Achilles, very late in the season torn Achilles, is just, I'm just going to have to see it.
44:52Like I'm probably just not going to partake in fantasy wise.
44:56I'm not going to draft him. Yeah, I'm having a hard time getting around to the optimism.
45:01I think people are really focused on all this optimism about a new type of Achilles repair and he can get on the field quicker.
45:09And I'm like, well, I want him to be the same George Kittle when he's on the field.
45:14The fact that he's always been a really highly efficient player is pretty important here.
45:19Is he going to have that explosiveness, you know, six months, eight months removed from a January Achilles tear?
45:25I guess it's not six or eight months, but it's not a year.
45:29He's going to play the whole year within a year of the actual injury.
45:34So you got to really hope that he's been able to rehab all the other muscles around it and still has all
45:40the quick twitch stuff and all that. Yeah, they're going to tell you all sorts of sunshine and rainbows.
45:46But I think, you know, if you're pessimistic about Kittle being able to be in 2026 what he's been in the past,
45:53you need to ignore all that optimism. So I'm so negative.
45:57I just bring the negative out on other people.
46:00You know, he's not going to cost so much that you'll ruin your season by taking him.
46:05No one's taking him in the fifth round anymore.
46:08Like he's going to go late. And I did get him in my top 12, number 12.
46:13So I'm trying to acknowledge that you're really, if you're not taking probably McBride and Bowers, as long as you're not taking
46:20those two guys at their prices, which is arguable, but the price is just so high that I will tend not to do it.
46:27You kind of can't ruin your season with any of these guys because there's going to be someone else.
46:33You know, you'll pick up Isaiah Likely who went undrafted in your draft because Kittle isn't doing anything and then you'll be okay.
46:41Like you're not going to ruin. It's just, you know, losing fantasy games week one, week two, week three while you decide that, that matters.
46:48That can hurt you by the end of the year.
46:51So it's, yeah, just hate to come across like don't want Kittle to be, you know, Kittle's one of my guys.
46:58I love Kittle. Like, of course I want him to be okay.
47:02That'd be great. But I just don't feel like I can believe.
47:06Much of anything that they say. How about, how about belief?
47:09Because Pearsall's injury stuff gets, has to be separated in two separate camps.
47:13One is getting shot. The other is having regular football stuff.
47:17And he certainly hurt his knee very early in the year last year and probably was never right.
47:22I'm with you that like, please give me like no injury drama in August and let people get hoodwinked by bad stats
47:29and a frustrating season because I have a feeling I will once again, there if I get, if I get the quiet
47:36August out of him, I think I could be in on Pearsall.
47:40Yeah, I agree. I mean, I think so too.
47:42He's, he's like, he had a much more, like if you look at the stats and in addition to what you're saying
47:49about the film, he had a much more interesting year too.
47:53His, his ADOT was a little higher. His targets per outrun were a little higher.
47:58He was earning more, more volume at a deeper depth and, and giving himself more room for, for yardage.
48:03I was optimistic about his, um, year two is his yards per target went up.
48:08Um, and so like his yards per outrun. I mean, those are some of the stats that I like to look at just as a barometer.
48:16I mean, it went up by like more than a half a yard.
48:20I mean, he, he looked like he was having kind of a breakout year too, but again, distance scoring touchdowns and he gets hurt again.
48:28And so it's just kind of a question of health and those things, but, um, I'm with you.
48:34Yeah, I think he's a guy you can certainly find the optimism in, even if it's just a quiet thing and we're
48:41not hearing injuries and we're not hearing those kinds of things.
48:44A couple of positive reports about pure salt, clean bill of health.
48:48He seems like a pretty good value. Me too.
48:51I think so too. All right. Uh, those are three very good teams.
48:55It seems like, although maybe one of them won't be because that's the way the NFL goes.
49:00And then the, the, uh, the team that obviously has no chance of being any good whatsoever.
49:05Uh, that's not true because teams surprise us all the time.
49:09The Cardinals last year, I just did win total talk to start the today's show.
49:14Their, their win total was eight and a half last year.
49:17Like people thought they'd be okay. And so they weren't, obviously they were awful, but like they can turn around and be okay again.
49:25Um, so, so these are the kinds of teams to me that we're going to find value on because the market's going
49:31to decide, I, you know, there's nothing there. They're not going to score any touchdowns.
49:36There's no yards there. McBride and nobody else. McBride and maybe love.
49:40And maybe, maybe that's right, but we're wrong all the time.
49:43Um, let's talk about love and the Cardinals backfield.
49:46Uh, you know, there's a chance to overreact, but there's so many players there that of course we need to be tracking
49:53this week by week in Cardinals camp. It, it matters what it sounds like.
49:57It matters if they trade one of the four bodies they have there.
50:01It matters if they cut somebody. It matters if somebody can't get healthier, can't get off the side fields.
50:07It's, you know, in the end, is it going to change?
50:11Are you going to go from Jeremiah love is a third round pick to Jeremiah should be taken at the end of the first?
50:18Probably not, but I assume this will, this is one you'll be tracking.
50:22Yeah. I mean, I think for me, it's, I'm most curious about who might be gone.
50:27They restructured Connor. They paid Algier some money. Then they drafted love.
50:31They seem completely done with Trey Benson, who they use a day to pick on a couple of years ago, but has obviously been unable to stay healthy.
50:40But before he got hurt last year, he was starting to earn more work from Connor before Connor's injury than he had the year prior.
50:48Then Connor goes down and it's like, oh, they were already trying to get him more work.
50:53He's been efficient. He's going to take off and then he gets hurt.
50:57And now he's like maybe fourth. And so like, if he's, if he's on the move somewhere, I actually think he could
51:04be pretty interesting in a different backfield. He had a 5.5 yards per carry rate last year.
51:09I mean, obviously it's not the most sticky staff, but some of the peripherals like to look at the evasion rate.
51:16Yards after contact. Some of that stuff was really interesting for him in year two.
51:21Never really ran a lot as a prospect or anything, but I'm certainly, I think Benson's the one I'm most interested in
51:28listening to or listening about and where he's at.
51:30And if they, if they let him go, cause they, they kind of seem, seems tough to keep all four of these guys around.
51:38Um, if Connor's the one they let go, I mean, he's a respected veteran, I think around the league that was kind of taught to talk about him.
51:47Like he's a, you know, a captain. And, um, if he winds up somewhere else, I think it could impact another, uh, backfield.
51:54So I'm, I'll be listening into Cardinals camp for, for those backs for sure.
51:58I do think love, I mean, what the, the draft capital is, as much as they've invested in him is going to
52:05be a big part of what they're doing going forward.
52:08And they gave a lot of guaranteed money to, to Tyler Algier, who does still plan some special teams and, you know,
52:15he's going to have some different roles, but he's going to be involved.
52:19But yeah, to your point, I mean, as they talk through these different things and what we hear, I mean, there's, there's
52:26a lot of uncertainty in this backfield. Um, and I think it could open up an opportunity or, or be bad for
52:33the assumed lead backs in another offense. It could open up, you know, the way that we now analyze a different backfield,
52:40depending on, you know, who it is and where they land and if they move and all of those things.
52:46Yeah. You know, the Packers get bad news on a Josh Jacobs suspension and suddenly Trey Benson is in Green Bay.
52:53We're going to look at it very differently. It's going to be its own challenge to figure out, okay, was he ever good?
53:00It's hard to know. He just didn't play a lot.
53:03Never saw him catch anything, but had the draft pedigree and had some obviously traits people liked.
53:08So it could change the way we feel about it.
53:11It's funny. I mean, love before he gets drafted by Arizona, people are ready to say he's the, he's it.
53:18He, I know everybody said Ashton Gentry was it, but no, this guy's really it.
53:22You're like, Oh God, you know, every, every year there's a guy who's it.
53:27And then as I said in the almanac, the beginning of love's blurb goes, it only took two words to prevent Jeremiah
53:34love from becoming the most hated man in fantasy in 2026, Arizona Cardinals.
53:38Because whatever leavening effect, the fact that love goes in the top five in the NFL draft, he gets, you know, smashed
53:45down because people decide he's in a completely unwinnable situation.
53:48Just, you know, I think probably even if Trey Benson had already been cut, people would still be like, it's still the Cardinals.
53:55He, you know, he's going to have a gente type situation from his rookie year where sure he might get a lot
54:02of work, but it's just going to be frustrating.
54:05And I don't want to, and my, I guess, philosophical bent is to say, cool, the offenses you decide are hopeless.
54:11I want to maybe invest in because we're wrong about off hopeless offenses all the time.
54:16And so it's, it's a weird back and forth with love where people are convinced the team will be terrible for sure,
54:23but convinced he's the greatest prospect ever. And I guess all of that is by way of saying, sure.
54:29I guess I can see a world where he becomes so undeniable in intra squad drills in the, you know, the controlled scrimmages against other teams and stuff.
54:38I can see a world where there, there starts to be real hype that moves loves ADP up into like the second round.
54:45Can't you? Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. Um, he's yeah. I mean, you, you, I, I, I like your take that these guys could
54:52be a lot better than people think because they're talking about him as, as so bad offensively.
54:57Um, and you have Trey McBride and you have this now really dynamic running back.
55:02And if Marvin Harrison can ever live up to anything close to his pedigree, I mean, there's a lot of skill position talent here.
55:09Actually, Michael Wilson had a great year last year.
55:12Um, the depth of running back we were talking about and yet one of the, one of the notes that has me
55:19concerned as I'm thinking through if I'm too low on them and listen to what you're saying, which, which I do really
55:26like the take is just that they, if you look at their, like the Vegas forecasted wind totals and look ahead to
55:33the 2026 stuff, they have the hardest schedule in the league by kind of a lot.
55:38Like even though they, you know, get a play last place schedule, they wind up, it's mostly because they have to play
55:45the other teams in their division twice each, but also the other divisions that the NFC West lines up with are tricky.
55:52And so the Cardinals are like 10 point underdogs in their first, like eight games or something, you know, there's some absurd
55:59stat that I saw and that just makes it really tricky for the running backs as well.
56:04But I do think they could be better than people expect.
56:07As you were saying, I just, I, I'm, I'm fascinated on, on, on sort of how their season could go with again,
56:14a lot of talent, but this extreme expectation that it's going to be a rebuilding year.
56:19Yeah. The, the noise that I'll be paying attention to at a Cardinals camp, they've got some really good beat reporters and
56:26I'll be paying attention to just is ever, is everybody sort of just, it's a fate accompli.
56:31Tyler Algier is mad that he signed there because he had no idea they were going to sign love and he's can't,
56:38you know, can't really get on the field on third downs.
56:42And James Connor is retiring and it just is love show.
56:45I can see a world where that happens. And I, and I, I have a love like RB 17 right now, which
56:52probably means I'm not, I'm mostly not going to get them, but that's not so low compared to where I usually am on the, on the rookies.
57:01I'm, I'm the crotchety version of the opposite version of you who, you know, I know you, I do enough drafts with
57:07you to know that you often are looking for upside you're reaching.
57:11Um, and I'm usually not that guy. I'm not so off on love that it's impossible that I could wind up elevating
57:18him if he gets that kind of camp. I, you know, whether or not that's possible with so many bodies, that's good question.
57:25I don't know. Maybe it's just not possible for somebody who's covering the Cardinals beat to get like that wound up on
57:32Jeremiah love when he's, when he's, you know, for half of camp, he's got to fight with three other guys for reps,
57:39you know, that much might be unrealistic, but I'll at least be somewhat susceptible to it.
57:44You mentioned the receiving, um, Marvin Harrison, Michael Wilson.
57:47I mean, Michael Wilson was just better last year and sure.
57:50Harrison had the appendicitis and he had other injuries and stuff, but like, there's just no, it was in a hopeless situation
57:57in service of a terrible long losing streak. And you don't really want Kobe Brissett throwing that much cause you're losing that
58:04by that much, but like, there's no world in which Michael Wilson didn't produce better than Marvin Harrison.
58:10How are you handicapping them to draft this year?
58:13I actually have them really close to each other in my ranks.
58:16Um, and then do you imagine a world where that can change in August?
58:21It's incredibly difficult. I like to look at the sort of longer term profiles back to college and those things.
58:27And, and, you know, obviously Harrison had the huge pedigree.
58:30Um, but you're right. Wilson is, is the one that looked like the better fit in the offense last year was incredible with percent.
58:38Um, I'm, I'm hitting capping them as, you know, relatively similar, um, probably leaning a little bit more toward Harrison, but I
58:45don't feel strongly about that at all. I, I, I don't think this is a, a situation we're going to learn a lot from camp.
58:52I guess the one thing for me is I do want to hear the reports on Carson Beck.
58:58I think sometimes with the, and, and watch him, you know, in the preseason.
59:02And sometimes we, we do get a decent feel for what the quarterback, the young quarterbacks could be and how quickly they're coming along.
59:10I think if he's playing a decent amount this year, that's probably a negative for the past offense relative to Brissette.
59:16Who's just got this big arm and stands back there and, you know, is going to get the ball out.
59:23And a lot of his dropbacks are going to turn to pass attempts.
59:27He's not going to necessarily take a ton of sacks or scramble or whatever.
59:31Young guys tend to hold it a little longer, uh, maybe take a higher sack rate and some of those things.
59:38And Brissette stood back there last year and threw the ball ton.
59:41And that's why we got so many targets to, to the key guy.
59:46I mean, Michael Wilson, 18 target game and two more 15 target games.
59:50And Trey McBride had like 50 more targets than any other tight end.
59:54I mean, it's, it was absurd last year. If Brissette's back there, even it'll be different in a different offense, but even
60:01in a different offense, you know, you have the optimism for a lot of volume targets and all of that.
60:07If Beck is getting a lot of buzz and I mean, what's the deal with Brissette?
60:12He's wanted a new contract all off season. And you know, is, is he going to hold out into camp?
60:18Like, what are we going to learn about Jacoby Brissette here in the next week or a couple of weeks?
60:24Is he going to report? And that's going to be that.
60:28Um, those are the things that I'm probably paying a little bit more attention to, but, um, and, and I, if it
60:35seems like Brissette's going to be the quarterback the whole year, I mean, I, I think Wilson had a real connection with
60:42him and I think the QB wide receiver connection stuff is pretty important.
60:46And so, um, yeah, the quarterback stuff is, is a huge part of what I'm looking at.
60:51Okay. Yeah, that's a good point. Um, it would be less exciting to have the rookie, uh, you know, uh, probably a more balanced offense.
60:59Um, man, what a, what a ring endorsement of the NFL draft industry to have Marvin Harrison fighting for the wide receiver
61:0640 spot or whatever, you know, ish, who knows where he's really going to go, but like woof two years ago, he was the 15 overall pick.
61:14That is not a very good evaluation by my brethren in college football, but I guess sometimes, sometimes you just miss it.
61:21Is Harrison the kind of kid that if he ever kind of just shook loose, he doesn't get the second contract from
61:28Arizona that he has the amazing second act and people look back and go, and yeah, that was just the stench of the Cardinals all over him.
61:36Possibly. Yeah. I mean, he was really productive in college.
61:39He earned a ton of volume like per route.
61:42And I, you kind of wonder if some of that was just sort of name and pedigree and stuff, but they had
61:49a lot of other good receivers there when he was there.
61:53And he was, he was definitely productive the first couple of years he's been bad, but like some of the, the per
62:00route stuff hasn't been like disqualifyingly bad. He doesn't look like a total complete Boston, like, you know, some of the stats.
62:06I think when you watch him, you're like, yeah, they're kind of forcing him some production so that it doesn't look bad.
62:13You know, like I'm, I'm with you. I think he's looked a lot worse on film than even the numbers say.
62:20So I have a hard time. I have a hard time seeing it, but I'm, you know, I, it's that uncertainty thing
62:27in the, you know, sort of trying to be a little bit, um, open to the idea that we can be wrong
62:34as you were talking about on the whole team level with the Cardinals, maybe as Harrison ages, we'll get more of what
62:41the draft evaluator saw and why he went so high.
62:44We'll get more of that shining through. I don't think that's impossible.
62:47Yeah. It's a really tricky one. This wide receiver core is a really tricky one.
62:52Agreed. Like you don't have to draft Marvin Harrison in a fantasy draft in 2026, as though you're positive about anything.
62:59You can draft him because he's not going to cost that much.
63:02You can take a shot. This is the year, you know, year one and year two, he was too expensive for what
63:09he wound up doing, but this year he's going to be just in the lump of every other receiver.
63:15And you can, you can get a little aggressive on him because you think there's some untapped upside.
63:21You're not going to ruin your fantasy team as a result.
63:24Uh, all right. Well, great talk, Ben. Thank you for helping me sort through these teams.
63:29Um, I hope you had fun we're going to tune into the stealing signals newsletter over on sub stack, uh, a great idea to subscribe.
63:37And in addition, uh, your, your podcasting, uh, you got stealing bananas.
63:41That's one of them. What's, what's the other podcast.
63:44It's called the long view. Cause I like to go long with Jacob Sanders and we just started it.
63:50Um, this month. Yeah. Congratulations on that. So much podcasting will ensue as well.
63:54And I'll have you back on in August. We'll find more top fun topics to talk about.
63:59I appreciate you helping me out with this one though.
64:03Yeah, absolutely. Thanks for having me on. And thank you so much for listening.
64:07Let me thank the wonderful sponsors that made today's show possible.
64:10You've heard me talk about Lisa lots of times.
64:13If it's not time for a new mattress, totally understand if it is, I hope you'll keep Lisa in mind.
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65:00Um, and then you may be wondering, Hey, you know, don't you drink AG one as well?
65:05I drink them both. I I'm only like, what is it?
65:09I'm three weeks in on cowboy colostrum because they just became a sponsor and they're, they're buying a couple of shows here,
65:16like just to see, to test the show and see if they get any interest from all of you.
65:22And what I'm told about the colostrum is that it's, it's like really intensely working on your stomach lining.
65:28And I can say I've, my stomach is just stinks.
65:31And so having both AG one and cowboy colostrum, it's a, it's a combo that I've very much think is working.
65:37And I haven't, I haven't seen benefits skin and hair yet.
65:41They say those benefits are there. Um, it's early for me, but I'm going to be doing it for a couple months.
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65:52Anyway, that was a lot of improvisational talk about sponsors.
65:55But if you're interested in any of the ones that I talked about today, you can find their information both in today's
66:02show notes and at the website at harrisfootball.com. I thank you so much for how much you do support the sponsors.
66:08It means a lot. So that's going to do it for this Tuesday episode.
66:13We are off until Friday coming up on Friday, a fellow that I just, I simply don't get to talk to enough.
66:20It says here, his name is Andrew Barans. So Andrew Barans.
66:23Oh, and I'm touching my fictional earpiece and being told it's Andy Barans with whom I've been making a podcast every single week for the entire year.
66:32We will do it on the free side this time.
66:35Andy's going to join and we're going to preview training camps for teams of the AFC West.
66:40That should be pretty fun as well. Until then, thanks again so much for listening.
66:45Your hat is awesome. You're awesome for wearing it.
66:47I will talk to you on Friday. The Harris Football Podcast's opening theme is Under the Gun by Apex Manor.
66:54The closing theme is Say Yes by The Wellspring.
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