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Fantasy Sleepers for 2026 With Hayden Winks and Josh Norris, Part 2

STACKED extracted the fantasy-relevant player signal from this podcast and kept the full transcript here for context.

1 hr 16 min
Duration
Estimated from transcript
Jul 24, 2026
Published
Fri, July 24, 2026
48
Player insights
32
Players mentioned
Topics
Kyler MurrayMalik NabersChristian WatsonSam DarnoldTerry McLaurinAntonio WilliamsBaker MayfieldCalvin Austin IIIChris RodriguezDaniel JonesDarius SlaytonIsaiah LikelyJ.J. McCarthyJameson Williams
Player analysis

Player insights

48

Antonio Williams

NegativeRole19:00

Williams is mentioned as a rookie option in the Commanders' receiver room, though the source provides no specific analysis or projection for his role.

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Baker Mayfield

PositiveProjection7:14

Baker Mayfield is cited as another example of the trend of elite quarterback prospects reclaiming careers after moving from bad teams to good teams. The source notes he was the number-one pick and went from being a scout team safety in the Panthers to a successful quarterback, illustrating the upside potential of high-pedigree quarterbacks in better situations.

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Calvin Austin III

NegativeRole27:03

Austin is mentioned as a secondary receiver option in the Giants' offense, part of the limited target competition for Malik Nabors.

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Chris Rodriguez

NegativeRole61:40

Chris Rodriguez, signed by Jacksonville for $10 million in free agency, is competing with Basial Tootin for lead-back duties. Rodriguez was coached by Liam Cohen at Kentucky and had strong production there. However, Rodriguez underwent surgery on his left foot in the offseason, which is concerning timing for a summer procedure. He is expected to be ready for training camp, but foot surgery carries injury risk. Advanced metrics show Rodriguez outperformed Tootin in yards after contact last season.

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Christian Watson

PositiveProjection54:57

The source projects Christian Watson as a top-tier wide receiver for 2026, finishing as WR17 on a per-game basis last season and showing improved versatility beyond just deep shots. Watson is described as the perfect fit for Jordan Love's downfield passing game. With the Packers removing Wicks and letting Dobbs walk, Watson will be on the field for every snap with no rotation. The source ranks Watson alongside Terry McLaurin and Jameson Williams, and suggests there's a decent chance Watson leads the team in targets. The source prefers Watson over Terry McLaurin straight up, citing superior talent and a more bankable offense.

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PositiveRole56:41

Watson's usage has shifted dramatically under Jordan Love; he moved from high-variance deep passes in his rookie season to more reliable short/intermediate targets. Out routes increased from 7.7% of his routes in his first three years to 35% last season, making him the go-to option on second-and-medium and third-and-short situations. This stabilization of targets—away from 20+ yard passes and toward gimmies—reduces variance and increases floor.

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PositiveValue57:30

Watson represents a value opportunity as a second or third receiver in drafts, allowing teams to stack elite running backs early (like Derek Henry in round three) and still secure a premier pass-catcher later. The source describes this as a 'cheat code' that enables late-round quarterback selection and overall roster flexibility.

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NegativeProjection58:00

The source believes Watson has legitimate upside to join the upper echelon of receivers, comparing him favorably to JSN-tier breakout candidates. Watson is described as a playmaker who transformed the Packers offense when he returned, with clear talent, size, and speed in an offense with a trusted play-caller and proven quarterback. The main concern is injury history, but the talent and situation alignment suggest significant upside.

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Daniel Jones

NegativeProjection5:09

Daniel Jones (Brosmer) is mentioned alongside JJ McCarthy as underperforming in fantasy; the source notes Brosmer 'gave him a run for his money late in the year,' suggesting both Vikings quarterbacks disappointed relative to the offense's historical production.

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Darius Slayton

NegativeInjury27:03

Slayton is mentioned as a Giants receiver option but is currently dealing with an injury, limiting his role in the offense.

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Isaiah Likely

NegativeRole27:03

Likely is mentioned as another pass-catching option in the Giants' offense, part of the target competition landscape for Malik Nabors.

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J.J. McCarthy

NegativeProjection5:00

JJ McCarthy's fantasy performance collapsed in 2025 despite Minnesota's historically strong quarterback production; the source questions whether McCarthy is 'the worst quarterback in the world' given the dramatic underperformance relative to prior Vikings quarterbacks in the Kevin O'Connell system.

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Jameson Williams

NegativeProjection56:05

The source compares Jameson Williams to Christian Watson, suggesting it is a true toss-up between the two receivers and that Watson may have a better chance of leading his team in targets. The source implies Williams is not significantly better than Watson in real life, despite being ranked higher in fantasy.

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Jayden Daniels

NegativeValue9:00

Jaden Daniels is going later than Kyler Murray in ADP, making him a relevant comparison point for quarterback value and opportunity cost analysis.

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Jayden Reed

NegativeRole55:50

The source identifies Jaden Reed as the slot receiver in the Packers' three-receiver set alongside Christian Watson and Matthew Golden, indicating his role in the offense.

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Josh Allen

NegativeProjection6:33

Josh Allen is referenced as a comparison point for Kyler Murray's rushing upside. The source notes that Kyler Murray had 570 rushing yards two years ago, which would have tied Josh Allen for the most rushing yards in 2025, demonstrating that Kyler maintains elite rushing quarterback upside despite his injury history.

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JuJu Smith-Schuster

NegativeRole39:47

The source mentions JuJu as a Gen Z personality on the Giants and notes John Harbaugh's signing of him, but provides no specific fantasy projection or role analysis. The reference is primarily cultural and contextual.

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Justin Herbert

PositiveProjection42:32

The source makes a bold projection that Justin Herbert is the best quarterback to ever play in a Kyle Shanahan-esque system and could potentially break Peyton Manning's passing touchdown record under Mike McDaniel's offensive system. Herbert is described as one of the fastest processors in the NFL with superior physical tools compared to other top quarterbacks, and the source suggests he might win MVP in 2026. The Chargers' offensive line upgrade and McDaniel's system design are cited as enabling factors for historic passing production.

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Keaton Mitchell

PositiveValue44:03

The source identifies Keaton Mitchell as a major value play, going 140th in drafts (outside the first 12 rounds) despite being the Chargers' backup running back in a Mike McDaniel system. The source notes he received $5 million guaranteed and $9 million over two seasons—comparable to Rico Dowdle money—suggesting the team is committed to his role. The source expects Mitchell to get approximately eight touches per game and projects him as a free piece of upside if drafted late. If Lad McConkie gets hurt, Mitchell could become the lead back in a high-powered offense.

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Kyler Murray

PositiveValue0:47

Kyler Murray to the Vikings is a strong value play because Kevin O'Connell's offense has consistently produced elite fantasy quarterback output regardless of the starter; Sam Darnold was QB8, Kirk Cousins was QB7 over multiple years, Nick Mullins was QB8 in limited starts, and Josh Dobbs averaged nearly 18 fantasy points per game despite not knowing the playbook. Murray adds rushing upside (averaging ~30 rush yards per game) on top of the passing production that has been consistent from the Vikings offense, making him a layup line at his draft price.

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PositiveProjection2:50

With Minnesota's passing offense production from the last four years plus approximately 30 rushing yards per game (Kyler's average), the source projects this as a 'layup line quarterback one' in fantasy; in best ball, even if benched mid-season, the quarterback position is deep enough to pivot, making Kyler a preferred late-round target over mid-round quarterbacks.

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PositiveValue3:08

The source recommends waiting for Kyler Murray in redraft rather than taking mid-round quarterbacks, citing the depth of the position this year with many young players; pairing Kyler with another late-round option like Dak Prescott or Jackson allows you to 'win the flex' and double-dip at the position.

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PositiveMatchup3:45

Kyler Murray throwing to Justin Jefferson versus Marvin Harrison will make 'a pretty big difference' in fantasy production; the source implies the Jefferson pairing creates upside relative to prior Minnesota quarterback situations.

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NegativeValue5:48

The source identifies Kyler Murray as a no-brainer late-round quarterback pick with minimal opportunity cost in fantasy drafts. The reasoning: he aligns with the trend of elite quarterback prospects recycled from bad teams to good teams (citing Sam Darnold, Baker Mayfield, Josh Allen); he's still athletic and recovered from ACL injury; he maintains rushing upside (570 rushing yards two years ago would have tied Josh Allen for most rushing yards in 2025); and waiting on him allows roster flexibility to avoid whack-a-mole at running back and receiver. The source states: "I think Kyler's a no-brainer. I don't think there's opportunity costs." The speaker is most confident this is a good fantasy pick among the players discussed.

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NegativeValue8:00

Kyler Murray is a no-brainer quarterback pick as long as he's outside the top 100 in ADP; the source's favorite quarterback this year because Lamar Jackson and Jaden Daniels are going later, and he's so cheap that injury risk and potential coaching transition concerns are overcome by the value.

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NegativeRole9:18

Kyler Murray has a documented tendency to drop his eyes and avoid throws, particularly in red zone situations; Trey McBride's production spiked after Jacob Brissett replaced Murray, indicating McBride was open in the 10-yard line but Murray would not target him. Murray needs to stand tall in the pocket and trust the middle field when facing pressure, a weakness that contrasts with Nick Mullins' comfort in Kevin O'Connell's offense.

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NegativeProjection11:26

Kyler Murray gets hurt a lot at the end of seasons and may not be available during the fantasy playoffs, creating downside risk despite his cheap ADP valuation.

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Lamar Jackson

NegativeValue9:00

Lamar Jackson is going later than Kyler Murray in ADP, making him a relevant comparison point for quarterback value and opportunity cost analysis.

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LeQuint Allen

NegativeRole62:30

LaQuint Allen is expected to consume 15-20% of Jacksonville's running back snaps regardless of the Tootin/Rodriguez competition, serving as a pass-protection specialist and coach's favorite. He handles two-minute, four-minute, second-and-long, third-and-long situations, and is a special teams contributor, limiting ceiling for other backs.

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Malachi Fields

NegativeRole27:03

Fields was drafted by the Giants in the third round and is mentioned as part of the receiver room, though the source provides no specific analysis of his role or projection.

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Malik Nabers

PositiveInjury27:03

Nabors suffered an ACL and lateral meniscus tear in week four with delayed surgery due to the meniscus injury, followed by a second surgery to remove scar tissue restricting rehab. However, the source cites Jordan Ronan's report that he is most likely to start on PUP (missing first four games) but could be eligible for week one or two, with coaching staff indicating he has made significant ground in July. The source argues that even if he misses the first three weeks, the injury discount is fully priced in at round four.

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PositiveValue27:03

Nabors has fallen from top-20 to round-four ADP due to injury concerns, but the source argues the discount is overdone; using 85% of his career PPG, he projects as WR13, and he had a 30% target rate in 2024 (matching only Jackson Smith-Njigba, Amon-Ra St. Brown, Jamar Chase, and Justin Jefferson). The source cites Jordan Ronan's report that Nabors could be eligible for week one (similar to Andrew Thomas's return timeline) and expects the Giants offense to improve from 31st in scoring when he played. The source ranks him 25th overall and would take him over DeAndre Washington, suggesting the injury discount is fully priced in.

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PositiveProjection27:03

The source watched Nabors on film and noted his ADOT of 20 yards downfield in 2024, showing he was winning deep and dominating underneath in prior years; he averaged WR6 in full PPR across his career despite playing with backup quarterbacks (Tommy DeVito, Daniel Jones) on a 31st-ranked scoring offense. The source compares his explosiveness and skill set to Jamar Chase and argues that if he returns healthy, the Giants' improved offense (with Jackson Dart and offensive line investments) could yield elite production.

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NegativeRole39:34

The source mentions Nabers as part of the Giants' Gen Z roster identity, noting his shit-talking personality as part of the team's cultural makeup. This is contextual rather than a specific fantasy projection or role analysis.

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PositiveBreakout55:25

The source references Malik Nabers' ACL tear in week four as context for discussing young, athletic receivers who can return to form. The comparison is made to Christian Watson, who finished as WR17 on a per-game basis despite missing time, suggesting Nabers has similar upside potential as a freak athlete with youth on his side.

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Malik Willis

PositiveSleeper3:58

Malik Willis is identified as a 'crazy shot in the dark' late-round quarterback option with a floor of rushing production and ceiling of passing upside; the source suggests waiting for Willis alongside Kyler Murray rather than taking mid-round quarterbacks will improve draft results on paper.

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Marvin Harrison Jr.

NegativeProjection64:00

The source has a standing rule not to rank Marvin Harrison Jr. over Michael Wilson no matter what, indicating strong skepticism about Harrison's 2026 outlook relative to Wilson. This is presented as a pre-season commitment to avoid being talked into a different stance.

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Matthew Golden

NegativeRole55:50

The source mentions Matthew Golden as a Packers receiver who will be on the field for almost every snap alongside Christian Watson, indicating he is part of the Packers' three-receiver rotation with Jaden Reed in the slot.

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Michael Pittman

NegativeValue5:25

Michael Pittman is noted as the player going after Kyler Murray in fantasy drafts, positioned as a cautionary example of the opportunity cost of waiting on quarterback. The source uses him as a foil to justify waiting on Kyler Murray instead, implying that reaching for Pittman at his current ADP is a mistake compared to the value of late-round quarterback selection.

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Odell Beckham

NegativeRole39:47

The source briefly mentions Odell as part of the Giants' Gen Z team culture, noting his personality aligns with the team's identity. This is a cultural observation rather than a specific fantasy insight.

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Oronde Gadsden

NegativeValue45:07

The source identifies Rondé Gadsden as the only Chargers player who is mispriced in a negative way in drafts. If the Chargers stay healthy, Gadsden is the exception to the team's overall undervaluation. This suggests the source has concerns about his draft capital relative to his role in the offense.

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Quentin Johnston

PositiveProjection44:22

The source projects Quentin Johnson as a high-upside receiver in the Chargers' Mike McDaniel offense, going outside the top 90 picks despite being positioned as the Jalen Waddell-equivalent receiver in the system. If Lad McConkie gets injured, Johnson becomes the number-one receiver. The source notes Johnson improved from being one of the worst receivers at catching the ball to closer to average, and he is a perfect fit for McDaniel's system with crossers and pre-snap motion. Johnson's run-after-catch ability and space creation are highlighted as ideal for McDaniel's scheme. The source plans to draft Johnson frequently despite not loving him as an individual player.

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Sam Darnold

PositiveProjection6:48

Sam Darnold is cited as a prime example of the defining trend of the 2020s: elite quarterback prospects recycled from bad teams to good teams reclaiming their careers. The source notes he was a top-three pick and has since won the Super Bowl, illustrating the upside potential of high-pedigree quarterbacks placed in better situations. This context supports the broader thesis that Kyler Murray, also a number-one pick, has similar reclamation potential.

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NegativeProjection8:50

Sam Darnold was the number eight quarterback in 2025 despite limited mobility, used as a reference point for quarterback value and opportunity cost analysis relative to Kyler Murray.

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Terry McLaurin

PositiveProjection18:45

McLaurin had the second most touchdowns in the NFL in 2024 and is positioned to benefit from Jayden Daniels' presence and a Commanders offense projected to be a shootout team with a weak defense; the source expects him to be the primary beneficiary of the team's need to score points.

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NegativeProjection56:05

The source mentions Terry McLaurin as a comparable receiver to Christian Watson and suggests Watson should be ranked alongside McLaurin. The source indicates a preference for Watson over McLaurin straight up, citing superior talent and a more bankable offense.

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Trey McBride

PositiveRole9:18

Trey McBride's production spiked significantly after Jacob Brissett replaced Kyler Murray as the Cardinals' quarterback, indicating McBride was consistently open in red zone and 10-yard line situations that Murray was not targeting him in, suggesting McBride's role and target opportunity may improve with a quarterback change.

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Tyrone Tracy

PositiveValue27:03

Tracy is positioned as a late-round sleeper contingent on Cam Saquon Barkley's injury; after Saquon went out in week nine, Tracy finished as RB18 in half-PPR points per game on a bad Giants team. He averaged 14 touches per game in 15 games and had 32 targets (12th among RBs) in the post-Saquon stretch, showing he is a capable pass-catcher. The source argues that if Saquon gets injured, Tracy can be arbitraged as a serviceable starter at a late-round price.

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Full transcript

Episode Transcript

971
0:00This episode is brought to you by NOS Energy, introducing new NOS Energy Grand Prix Guava.
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0:34Go ahead, crack open a can of NOS Energy and get after it.
0:38Welcome to The Ringer Fantasy Football Show. My name is Danny Heifetz and I am joined by Danny Kelly.
0:43And today, we will once again be joined by Josh Norris and Hayden Winks from Yahoo Fantasy Football.
0:48Because Craig is on vacation in Hawaii. We had Josh and Hayden on while Craig was out.
0:53And we had such a good time and they were so good that we actually just went long enough that we split it into two parts.
1:00So part one we published last week. This is going to be part two of our favorite players entering this season.
1:06It's just our favorite picks relative to value and honestly the most important players in fantasy this year.
1:11So we hope you enjoy the episode. And then Craig will be back this week.
1:16And then we will get to hot quarterbacks. What everyone's waiting for.
1:19We can't do hot quarterbacks without Craig. So that's a promise we made when he left.
1:24So without further ado, part two with Josh and Hayden, favorite players.
1:27All right, let's get to the show. Wait, what about the live show?
1:31Yes, live show. Also, yes, live show Thursday, August 27th.
1:34We still have some tickets left. If you're in Southern California, live show Thursday, August 27th.
1:38Tickets are in the episode description. The link, your Earl, as DK calls it.
1:42TheRinger.com slash events. And yeah, so go grab tickets to the live show Thursday, August 27th.
1:47Now we can get to the show. A similar-ish player to Jalen Hurts, not necessarily physically, but questions about whether they can
1:53run an offense or whatever is Hayden. You said Kyler Murray for the Vikings was one of your favorite.
1:58Whatever. DK, what are we calling this episode? Sleepers?
2:01Favorite players? Sleepers slash values. Sleepers slash values. Great values.
2:04Hayden, your sleepers slash value quarterback is Kyler Murray, who I think there's similar questions of, can they just, do they have
2:10to play to their style because they can't see over the line of scrimmage or can they run whatever offense?
2:16He's in Minnesota. Why do you like Kyler so much this year?
2:19I just like Kevin O'Connell and Justin Jefferson. I mean, it's just been a print fest.
2:24It doesn't matter who it was. I remember Sam Darnold, like how egregious he was.
2:28And then he was the quarterback eight in this offense.
2:31Kirk Cousins was the quarterback seven with Kevin O'Connell for over years.
2:34Nick Mullins was the quarterback eight when he got his starts.
2:37Josh Dobbs, literally off of a private jet, comes into the facility and doesn't even know the playbook.
2:42He was, he averaged almost 18 fantasy points per game as well.
2:46The offensive line is healthier this year. Kyler Murray has been a fantasy quarterback.
2:50All those guys I just mentioned, they don't run.
2:52Like that was all passing stuff. Kyler Murray runs on like those guys.
2:56So if we just get like some semblance of the passing numbers that those offenses last four years have done with Minnesota
3:02plus 30 ish rush yards per game, which Kyler Murray's average, I'm like, this is a layup line quarterback one.
3:08So like in best ball, it's a little trickier because in theory he could get benched in a redraft.
3:13Even if he does get benched, you know, halfway through the season, you just pick up somebody else.
3:19The quarterback's really deep. So to me, it's like, that's the thing is there's like maybe like 15 to 20 quarterbacks.
3:25I do think you could start in week one in fantasy.
3:28So if you want to just load up and win the flex, and then you just kind of double dip Kyler Murray,
3:34Jackson, dark Kyler Murray with Dak Prescott. You name the combination.
3:37I do think that's how I'm kind of playing it in redraft just because like this depth is so obvious this year with a lot of young players.
3:45But I think, you know, Kyler Murray throwing the ball to Justin Jefferson versus Marvin Harrison, I think is going to make a pretty big difference.
3:52Yeah. Hi, Fitz, you made a comment like 10 minutes ago where you said it's, I think, more difficult this year to find sleepers or identify sleepers.
4:00When you get into drafts this year, like once, I don't know, round 10 or 11 hits, you're like, I don't want to select any of these players.
4:08It is disgusting out there. And I think some of that is maybe the running back poor draft class that we just had.
4:15I think some of that is the changes in heavy personnel across the league that we're getting more of these two and
4:21three tight end looks, which means those fun slot receivers that would, you know, theoretically get us fantasy points over the previous
4:27years are just irrelevant now across the league that what Hayden is saying, instead of maybe taking the elite or especially kind
4:33of those metal to your quarterbacks, just wait for freaking Kyler Murray in your drafts.
4:38And like Malik Willis is also out there as a crazy, you know, shot in the dark as the late round quarterback
4:44that had the floor of rushing and then hopefully the ceiling with the passing on top of this.
4:49And you'll probably like your drafts on paper if you wait for Kyler versus taking one of those middle round quarterbacks.
4:55I think this is, yeah, this is going to be such an interesting season for the Vikings because it does feel a
5:01little bit like the shine has come off of Kevin O'Connell just a little bit based on what happened.
5:07But when you say, Hayden, when you read off all those quarterbacks that were just absolutely going bonkers and fantasy and is
5:13JJ McCarthy the worst quarterback in the world? What the hell happened?
5:16Because that was, I mean. Brosmer's right there with him.
5:19I mean, Brosmer gave him a run for his money late in the year.
5:23But yeah, maybe that was like a false flag to make McCarthy seem better.
5:27I don't know. Right, right. I just think I agree with everything Hayden's saying here.
5:32I think Kevin O'Connell is the truth. I think he knows how to coach up and make things easier for his quarterback
5:38and, you know, put together an offense that is going to.
5:41It's like what Shanahan does, essentially. You know, it's like every guy who goes in here is going to average eight yards per attempt, you know?
5:48Maybe he like lost his magic or whatever. What is, Hyphens, what's the reference you always use?
5:53The Monstars or whatever? Oh, like when they take Michael's secret stuff.
5:57Well, I think for Kevin O'Connell, I think it was Grant Udinski leaving to the Jags.
6:01I think Kevin O'Connell, everyone said he's a quarterback whisperer.
6:04I think he might just be really hot and tall.
6:07But the, yeah, they stole a special Udinski. I will say, I think of all the things, or sorry, DK, you keep going.
6:13Well, I was just going to say, you know, Kyler is such a polarizing quarterback in so many ways.
6:19Not only the way he plays football, where, you know, he's very short and he scrambles a lot.
6:24And, you know, there's certain parts. You compared him to a toddler that stole your phone in your draft.
6:29He just has a very polarizing style of play.
6:32And the body language thing is a major. GTA 6 is coming out this year, which could be a catastrophe.
6:38There's the meme that is also proven true pretty much every year that he falls off, you know, after they released the newest version of Call of Duty.
6:45And so. Which is an unfair stereotype because he only plays the video games after he gets hurt every December.
6:51Like that, you know, that's the real reason. But I want to believe.
6:55I want to believe. And I think I will be taking Kyler just because I think the upside is certainly there, especially where you can get him.
7:03If I had to pick which of, and again, if everyone here brought like some of their favorite players, if I had
7:09to pick one that I'm most confident is a good fantasy pick, I think it's this one with Kyler Murray.
7:15Because I think it aligns with everything real life and fantasy trend line that's happening, which is to hit like the opportunity
7:21cost of taking Kyler Murray is nothing. Again, shouting out you guys at Yahoo now.
7:25The player going after Kyler Murray in fantasy drafts is Michael Pittman on the Steelers.
7:29If Michael Pittman and Aaron Rodgers is the reason I lost my fantasy league, so be it.
7:34Like the idea that like we're going back, there are so many rushing quarterbacks that you might as well wait on quarterback
7:40again and load up at all these other positions and not play whack-a-mole at running back or receiver, which is just mentally
7:47and emotionally taxing and makes fantasy not fun. I think waiting on Kyler Murray makes so much sense for so many reasons,
7:53including you're not compromising getting a rushing quarterback. Two years ago, he had 570 yards.
7:57He basically would have been tied for Josh Allen for the most rushing yards last year, if that was the 2025 total for Kyler.
8:04He did that two years ago. He's still athletic.
8:07He's recovered from the ACL. The combination also of all these quarterbacks in real life, I think, to me, the trend, everyone
8:13talks about the two tight end sets and that's absolutely a trend.
8:16But to me, the defining trend of football in the 2020s is the recycling of the careers of the elite quarterback prospects
8:23going from bad teams to good teams. Like if you look at all these guys that have had reclaimed careers, they were all really high prospects.
8:30Sam Darnold, who won the fucking Super Bowl, was a top three pick.
8:34Baker Mayfield, who was scout team safety in the Panthers, was the number one pick.
8:38You know what I mean? Josh Allen developed. But if you look around, Kyler Murray was a number one pick.
8:44Like all these guys have elite traits. And I think Kyler Murray is still at the tail end of his physical prime.
8:50And it's not, to your point, if Sam Darnold was the number eight quarterback and he's not even like a huge, right?
8:56He can run a little. I don't know. I think Kyler's a no-brainer.
9:00I don't think there's opportunity costs. I think it makes sense on every level.
9:04So I really love this. And I agree. He's my favorite quarterback this year.
9:08And the only reason I even have to think about it is Lamar and Jaden and other guys are going later.
9:14But as long as Kyler's outside the top hundred, I think he's my quarterback.
9:18At the same time, can I express, though, some frustrations about Kyler Murray's game?
9:22Because I don't know if we've done that enough in this conversation.
9:25Like he does drop his eyes and play the hokey pokey and like turn down throws a lot.
9:30Yeah. It is so obvious. And for all of you that played fantasy football, Trey McBride's production blasted off after, you know, Kyler was replaced by Jacob Brissett.
9:38Because whenever you go and watch the games inside the red zone, inside the 10-yard line, Trey McBride was open in those situations.
9:45And for some reason, Kyler would just not target him in those scenarios.
9:48He needs to stand tall. He needs maybe difficult.
9:51And then in the face of pressure, like throw the middle field, trust what the offense is going to be there.
9:57And like I went back and watched Nick Mullins to prepare for Kyler Murray in this offense.
10:02And like Nick Mullins was doing that. He had zero fear when there was, you know, a missed blitz pickup or a
10:08free rusher in his face because he knew KOC's offense, which, you know, just a couple of seasons ago was ninth in scoring and eighth in scoring.
10:16Like if a play was going to be open and the ball is there on time, then you have big play was there to be made.
10:23And so we just have to have Kyler like have trust in his environment.
10:27I understand where that was lost in Arizona, but at the same time, that's kind of like the last, you know, exposure
10:33that we do have here with Kyler Murray. I, and to that point, and again, cause I think this is one of
10:40the more interesting things also for real life football, cause the NFC North is the best division in football.
10:45It's hard to pick who's going to miss the, who's going to win the division and miss the playoffs among the Lions, Bears, Vikings, Packers.
10:52The other thing is we haven't talked about enough is what does the offense look like?
10:57Because Kevin, the Vikings have been under center almost half the snaps.
11:00The Vikings have played Kyler Murray, I believe has been under center at times about one out of every six plays, which
11:06Bill Barnwell, he has been at this great stat.
11:09Kyler Murray has basically been in shotgun 10 times more than he's been under center.
11:13It's like 1800 snaps to 180. That's pretty nuts.
11:16And I am curious what it looks like with the Vikings, but I think there's something to be said.
11:21There is a world where at the end of this, just any coach's stock that rises falls.
11:26Brian Dable's stock rose and fall quickly for the Giants.
11:29Dan Campbell, one more bad season with the Lions and people are going to turn on him.
11:34Kevin O'Connell quarterback whisper again, if he doesn't play well and he lets Sam Donald go for McCarthy and then can't do
11:40anything with Kyler, like that is the downside. And also Kyler gets hurt a lot at the end of seasons and like
11:46in the fantasy playoffs, he might not be there for you, but I think he's so cheap it overcomes it.
11:52But I think those are good points, Josh. My last thing real quick is the NFL PA reports.
11:57I mean, I've never been able to benefit off of reading those.
12:00We're going from dead last with the Arizona Cardinals to literally number one.
12:04I mean, that is like speaking of environments like this is like we're talking about like picking up, you know, meals on a Wednesday.
12:11It's way better for Kyler Murray this year than it was previously.
12:14So it's not even just the environment and who he's throwing to in the offensive lines, like literally like just like walking around the stadium being appreciated.
12:22Like his family is allowed to like take home food.
12:25Like all those things are happening for Kyler Murray for the first time ever.
12:29It's such a good point. I think culturally, I think it's, I think it's hard for us to understand these guys who
12:35go to college and like Kyler Murray going to Oklahoma, Joe Burrow going to LSU.
12:39And then Kyler goes to Arizona. And like your college facilities were 10 times nicer.
12:44Joe Burrow goes to the Bengals that have a practice, went from LSU to a team that didn't have a practice facility in the winter.
12:51And it's fucking jarring to go to an NFL team that suddenly is charging you for box lunch when your dining hall
12:57in Oklahoma was like nicer than anything Arizona has ever had.
13:00His high school, that school that he went to in Texas is ridiculous.
13:04Kyler, one of my favorite stats since I've been covering the NFL is that Kyler's height, firstly, he's the best quarterback maybe
13:10ever in the history of Texas high school football.
13:13He went 40 something and 0, won three championships in a row.
13:16But his high school stadium had a larger capacity than the one the Chargers did in 2019.
13:21Kyler, or 20, his rookie year, Kyler played in front of fewer people for a Cardinals Chargers game than he did when
13:27he won a championship or regular season high school games when he was in high school.
13:32I was an intern for the Chargers during that, uh, during that season.
13:36Yeah. That's where I was at the StubHub Center.
13:38I was. That was, that was me. I changed the whole marketing department for forever for the Chargers.
13:43What was the saddest thing you saw when the Chargers?
13:46Oh no. Oh my goodness. Cause I would go, they would, I would go there.
13:50The new facility is great. I love the Chargers, but during the, the transition was tough cause they got kind of outed from LA stadium deal.
13:58I didn't get a plus one for the, the, um, Christmas party after being there for, for a full year.
14:03And that was kind of like, so I was like, really?
14:07That's kind of crazy. Okay. Josh, give me another sleeper and or favorite player entering this year.
14:11Whatever satisfies DK's criteria that you, a player you like for 2026.
14:15Yeah. I actually think I'm stealing from DK's list here.
14:18Uh, but let's go with Terry McLaurin. He's wide receiver 22 in consensus rankings right now.
14:22And one of my favorite things over the summer is to try to find these hidden edges.
14:27And I think one is when new play callers come in and it's so difficult for us, especially with a veteran like
14:33Terry McLaurin to try to predict the difference in usage and how much that is going to change his fantasy output.
14:39Uh, and I think the commanders are like at the top of the list for a lot of the fancy names this season.
14:46Um, in his career, Jaden Daniels has 33 dropbacks from center 33 from under center.
14:50Okay. We know Cliff's offense while very successful during Jane's rookie season, it got extremely stale and it kept someone like Terry McLaurin.
14:57So static, right? I think he ran 74% of his routes just on the line of scrimmage at that left wide receiver spot.
15:03Like that is absurd for your number one pass catcher.
15:06So now the defense knows where the best player will be at the start of every play.
15:11Exactly. And Cliff didn't want to do anything about it.
15:14I understand they had success, but then this is probably a good one.
15:17Probably why they wanted to replace him this, this off season.
15:21So now we have like a more balanced approach.
15:23All you're going to hear from Washington this year is we're going to get more motion.
15:28We're going to get more play action. And then David Blau already said, Hey, how do we get Terry McLaurin 10 targets per contest?
15:34That is music to my ears to so clearly the best offensive player on that team outside of Jane Daniels.
15:40That if we talk about funnels and concentration of targets and opportunities, I don't see how Terry McLaurin doesn't average eight and
15:46a half to about 10 and a half targets per game this season.
15:50Yeah. I had this too. I love Terry McLaurin this year.
15:53And it kind of goes to, if you're trying to identify offenses that could bounce back and be closer to, you know,
16:00what their potential is last year, it was just truly everything that could have gone wrong for, for the commanders last year did injuries.
16:06You know, just the coaching. Terry held out for training camp as well.
16:10Like he missed. And that obviously now, as we know, after the last three or four years impacts fancy output is when these guys miss training camp.
16:18Yeah. Especially when you're living on the narrow razor edge margin of just being the best deep connection in the NFL, which
16:24is really what Jaden and McGuire were doing. Like those are very thin margin plays that you need the practice time.
16:30I kind of look at, and some people might take this as a negative.
16:34I, I, I kind of, I'm saying this complimentary Terry McLaurin has kind of Terry McLaurin and Jane Daniel specifically kind of
16:40have that Russell Wilson, DK Metcalf connection where it's like, he's just trusting.
16:44I'm going to throw it up there down there for him because I trust him to go get it.
16:49I think Terry McLaurin is a very good player.
16:52I think this offense could make a big jump back to what we saw in 2024 when they were like off the
16:58charts, levels of swag for that whole offense. Basically like Jaden Daniels was the best rookie quarterback I've seen.
17:04It felt like forever. He was since RG3. He, I mean, I'm in DC.
17:08The Jaden almost sink, not single-handedly, but I actually, I don't talk about this a lot, but like I do do reporting sometimes.
17:14I asked Terry McLaurin himself and they were mad at me because I wasn't supposed to talk to him, but I, I
17:20asked him in the locker room because we proposed the same weekend to our wives.
17:25And I asked him, like, I started with that and then I asked him like, how much of the success of this,
17:31like third, this crazy season you're having is Jane Daniels.
17:34And he actually thought about it for a second.
17:36He's like half, he's like literally half Jaden, half every other person who works for the team player, coach assistant.
17:42And he was like, that's how important quarterback is.
17:45And, but like, dude, I, he literally was the best season in 30 years.
17:48I can't tell you how many, I lived here for five years.
17:52No one walked around with a goddamn commander's Jersey.
17:54No one had them. They weren't. And now they're like, there were more, I live in the city.
18:00There were more Ravens jerseys at my supermarket or the stores buy it than there were Washington.
18:04Now it's like, you see Jaden everywhere. So he's a phenomenon.
18:08It's a fun player to have, which I actually think is the most underrated part of fantasy football is just like, do you like having these players?
18:15Yeah. And Jaden is top tier. What's it like to have a gun?
18:19It's like having two cocks. I mean, having that guy on your team is like having two cocks.
18:24Um, but yeah, McLaurin, the, like the other thing I think that's interesting is like, we, we don't really know anything about
18:30what David Blau is going to bring. Like, do you, what do we, what do we know about David Blau?
18:36He also wants to try to get a quarterback.
18:39That's good enough for me. He's not getting a quarterback.
18:41Well, he said he wants to get Terry 10 targets a game.
18:45And that's one of those that sounds sick. And you're like, well, coaches aren't great with math.
18:50And like, you know, who are they throwing to if they're not getting Terry McLaurin 10 targets per game?
18:55Dude, I fucking Luke McCaffrey. I don't know. Is it?
18:58I mean, do you get like Shigo Conquo and I, he doesn't know how to catch.
19:02It's like Traylon Burks, Antonio Williams, the rookie, a handful of random other dudes.
19:06Let's see here. There's a, oh, it's bad. Luke McCaffrey, Jalen Lane, who's more of like a special teams guy.
19:12They signed Deami Brown and Van Jefferson. This is how the Packers used to look.
19:16Devante Adams had four number four receivers that, and they, Washington is eight number four receivers.
19:21I think, and you're, yeah, I think it's going to be Terry McLaurin and then Chigga Conquo might have actual chance to be, to be something in fantasy.
19:29But the other thing that I wanted to bring up here, which I think is, and we don't know yet really, but I think there's a chance.
19:37This is another team. I mentioned it with the 49ers.
19:39This is another team whose defense is probably going to be not very good.
19:43I mean, if you look at what they did in the off season, the, almost their entire starting off, like defense is
19:50free agents that they signed this off season. When has that ever gone well?
19:54You know what I mean? Like in the history of the NFL, it's usually not a good sign.
19:59If like you're filling your entire defense, all the starting spots with free agents or rookies, sunny styles obviously could be really good.
20:05But, um, you know, it's just a bunch of kind of hired guns to go on defense and try and fix, fix it.
20:12Like some of the holes that they had on defense.
20:15I think this is going to be a shootout team.
20:18I think they're going to have to score a lot of points and I think they're going to have to let Jane do his magic.
20:25Like in McLaurin is going to be the big benefit from that.
20:28Like he had second, he had the second most touchdowns in the NFL in 2024.
20:32I feel like we're just kind of forgetting about it.
20:35We're enamored with the shiny new things that are happening from last year.
20:39You know, Caleb Williams and the Bears offense. Everyone's really excited about that.
20:43But I think Jane Daniels can kind of bring the magic back for the commanders on offense at the very least.
20:49Um, so yeah, I, I will mention like with the chick thing, I was talking to Ben Stanek does a great job
20:55covering the commanders and he mentioned, he's like, we can't really talk about what's happening at the, at practices.
21:00But I will say I saw chicka Kwonk will catch a lot of passes or something like that.
21:05You know what I mean? So like, I'm like at the very least they don't have a number two receiver on this team.
21:12Maybe Antonio Williams is a guy, maybe trail on Burks finally can stay healthy and he could, he can do it.
21:18Do a little bit of stuff. But yeah, or I, you, I mean, maybe they assign Debo, maybe they sign digs that,
21:24that could kind of like, you know, change the, the, I don't want to alienate your offense, but, uh, Chico Kwonko is my most drafted player this summer.
21:32And then I'll just, is he really the rest of the show?
21:36Like it's pretty disgusting, but it's for all the reasons we just discussed here.
21:40Yeah. Um, I mean, look, go 2024, not that he's the same player, even remotely, but Zach Hertz was like the number two receiver on that offense.
21:47Um, so a lot of the offense flowed through the title.
21:50He had incriminating evidence on Cliff Kingsbury's trip to Thailand.
21:53He had to probably what was going on there.
21:56Um, 16 million guaranteed. They paid him kind of a lot.
21:59Like that's not nothing for a guy who hasn't really done anything in his career.
22:03Washington's a weird team, to be honest. I mean, I also have a whole paragraph written on Bill Krosky merit here as
22:09well as like, I would love the offensive line.
22:12What do you think of the Washington running? We haven't talked to Washington backfield.
22:16Rashad white, you know, bill merit. Like this is kind of, I mean, this is the Island of misfit toys.
22:22Yeah. I mean, it's a weird backfield. I'll just throw one stat at you.
22:26All right. Per fancy points, the commanders were best in the NFL and outside zone runs last year in terms of blocking at 6.1 yards per carry.
22:33This is supposedly what David Blouse also brings to the table this year.
22:37Bill Krosky merit led the NFL in yards per carry out on outside zone runs at 7.6 yards per carry.
22:43Uh, he doesn't catch passes. At least didn't last year.
22:46He fumbled way too much. Uh, he became a meme player because he had this long ass name and we all just condensed it down to bill.
22:53Uh, and as a seventh round rookie, that gets a ton.
22:56His uncle did that. I'll have you know. And then didn't do anything in the regular season as much, despite actually leading
23:03this team, what in carries and rushing yards and rushing touchdowns, I believe.
23:06Um, I don't remember any of that. I'm, I'm just, I'm just into, Hey, maybe the second year, seventh rounder where they
23:13only added Katron Allen and a pure receiving back in Rashad white might actually have a bit more opportunity than is getting
23:19credit for as the running back 39 consensus rankings.
23:21Right. You have piqued my interest because I do think I am a big believer that a players that go late in drafts or undrafted that then perform.
23:29And then the team to your point, doesn't do anything to change their role.
23:33We always underrate like a Monro St. Brown is the perfect example of this, of if a first round player had done
23:40what a Monro did his rookie year, he would have like, we would have just taken it at face value immediately.
23:46But because a Monro wasn't expected to be that good, it took like two years for us to actually be like, he
23:52should probably just be in the first round of fantasy drafts.
23:55It took like a long time. And obviously he was still like a third or fourth round pick, but, and bill was
24:01not, but I think you're right that like, if they let Chris Rodriguez go and Chris Rodriguez might maybe be the starter for Jacksonville.
24:08And so, yeah, I don't hate it. Do you agree?
24:11Like we have merit here next to Kyler Murray.
24:13You were just saying he's your favorite. I think Rashad White's just annoying enough to get in the way of this.
24:19And then I kind of liked Kate Ron Allen for what he is as an, as an RB three.
24:25I think it's going to be a committee. Rashad White.
24:28I can see him being like the goal line back.
24:31Cause he's got a little bit of size on bill and then catching some passes.
24:35So he's one of these names where I think like where he goes, I can see him being like a flex play.
24:41You're not going to win your league cause Rashad White, but there's like some Javante Williams kind of there.
24:46If the offense takes off and he can kind of consolidates things, but it, I'm kind of staying away from the backfield.
24:53Like there's, there's some upside here, but I think that the skill sets compliment each other so well that I think they're
24:59just going to lean into that and just kind of kind of leave us stuck.
25:03Final point on this high heads. The commanders are projected for the same amount of points as the Colts bucks, Texans and Jaguars this year.
25:10And really we're only drafting with confidence, Jaden Daniels and Terry McLaurin.
25:14And that's it. And I feel like there is at least one, if not two names that will be fancy relevant at for certain sections of the season.
25:22So Vegas thinks that this is going to be a good environment for fantasy points.
25:26That's what Jared Smola found. They're, they're top 10, they're 10th in fantasy environment.
25:30And, and like, you know, like, like you just said, Josh, we're kind of just like overlooking it.
25:35I agree. Like it's hard to figure out what's going to happen with this backfield.
25:39If, if you would have told me that Bill Merritt had 800 yards rushing and eight touchdowns last year, I would have
25:46been like, no, there's no way, no way in hell.
25:49He had 805 yards rushing. I don't think I realized that at all.
25:52But yeah, I think, you know, finding, I think there is, you know, like a value to be mined from this offense.
25:58If they get back even close, they don't have to get back to what they did in 2024, because that was like lightning in a bottle potentially.
26:06But I do think they're going to be a lot better than they were last year.
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26:58Another name I want to get to. I was surprised when you threw this guy out, Hayden.
27:03You said Malik Nabors for the Giants, who I was very – I'm a huge Giants fan.
27:07I was very blinded by optimism in like the beginning of the spring.
27:11I yelled at Craig because he rated him Malik Nabors low on something I don't even remember.
27:16And then second surgery, like slow recovery, all this stuff.
27:19Malik Nabors has plummeted. And then do you think it's gone too far?
27:22Like you think Malik Nabors is like a value now if he's like now gone from top 20 to a top 50 player?
27:29He's in round four. And I was like starting to do some just like simple, you know, boy math here.
27:35And I was like, all right, if we take 80 – let's say 85% of his career fantasy points per game.
27:41He's still like the wide receiver 13 based off of that.
27:44And keep in mind, those games that he was playing with the Giants for the first year in the first four games,
27:50that Giants team was 31st in points, 27th in passing yards.
27:53I don't think we expect the Giants to be 31st in scoring this year.
27:57So I do think there's an outcome where he's not as good, but the environment kind of picks up a little bit
28:03because Jackson Dart and the offensive line, they made some investments.
28:07And I just think that the report from Jordan Ronan who said that he thinks he's going to be closer to the
28:13Andrew Thomas situation, which he came back in week three.
28:16He didn't start on PUP. Ronan thinks there's a chance that he could be eligible for week one, and he's not expecting
28:22this to be a huge deal because July he's made up a lot of ground.
28:26That's what they're saying from the coaching staff. So all of a sudden, I think that we've kind of hit the bottom of this.
28:33He's going to probably start the training camp on PUP.
28:36Maybe that drops his ADP a little bit. But right now, if we learn that he's going to be available in week
28:42one or week two, would we not be drafting him where Devontae Smith is, like George Pickens?
28:47That feels really appropriate for me. And if he had no injury, he would be the sixth overall player in fantasy.
28:53So I think that the injury discount, I think, is fully priced in at this point.
28:57I've recorded over a thousand shows with Hayden, and him mentioning Malik Nabors for this one floored me.
29:03But he just outlined why. Can we just go through the timeline, though, just real quick of what has happened to Malik Nabors here?
29:09I mean, an ACL and lateral meniscus tear in week four.
29:13Then surgery was delayed a month because of that meniscus.
29:15Then he had a setback, as you said. So a second surgery to remove scar tissue that was restricting his rehab.
29:21And then other than that run-on report, what we've heard all summer is that he's most likely going to start on PUP,
29:28which means what you missed the first four games.
29:30And then we don't know about the timeline and all that stuff.
29:34My biggest issue with Malik Nabors is this, that he's still going in this area of wide receivers that leave you with the question of what if.
29:41Like there's a lot of optimism around Emek Agbuka and Lad McConkie and T-Mac and Garrett Wilson.
29:46We've already talked about Jalen Waddle and Luther Burton and all these guys.
29:50Because in your head, your first response from Malik Nabors is on the board in comparison to those is, oh, well, he's injured.
29:56And it's almost like pessimism versus the extraordinary optimism of, oh, those teams are 0-0 and all these teams have improved and they're young and up-and-coming players.
30:04And so that's my biggest difficulty of not only ranking but drafting Nabors right now is who he's going around.
30:10The other thing I want to say is you don't get zero points if he misses the first three games.
30:15You still start somebody in your roster. Like you're getting some, in the first three weeks, if you can't put somebody in
30:22your roster and you're starting lineup in fantasy that's going to give you some points, that's a personal problem.
30:27Like we're not talking about later on. Like week one, you can't throw freaking Josh down in your starting lineup and get away with it.
30:34And I like all those players that you mentioned.
30:37Those receivers are all very good players. Malik Nabors, it's like almost Jamar Chase.
30:41I mean, like he is exceptional. I went back and watched him just this morning because I was getting fired up after the Ronan report.
30:48And I was like, dude, this guy was cooking everybody.
30:51His ADOT last year was 20 yards down the field, you know?
30:54So he was winning all the way down the field.
30:57He was dominating underneath the year prior. And he didn't get to have Jackson Dart.
31:01Like I was looking back, he had Tommy DeVito, Daniel Jones when he was on the Giants, all these like backup receivers.
31:08It was so bad. Like he had a stretch where he was like the wide receiver 40 for like a month.
31:13And still, if you average out his entire career, he's the wide receiver six in full PPR.
31:18Even having some of these disastrous months with quarterbacks that are going to be offensive coordinators instead of NFL quarterbacks.
31:24So I just think like if it's week one, week two, week three, and he's in the fourth round, we could survive
31:30with Josh Downs in our starting lineup for two weeks.
31:33It's easy to say round four. It's harder when I put names to it.
31:37Would you take Malik Nabors over Lad McConkie? I have Malik Nabors ranked 25th overall.
31:41I would have him over to Montesquist. 25th? I would take him over to Montesquist.
31:46So you're basically saying that you think he'll be fully healthy in week five.
31:50You'll miss the first month. And if you go three and one, and then you get Nabors in week five, it's like
31:56you had two first or second round picks for the rest of the year.
32:00And you think he's fully healthy. And then he's like an actual number one receiver rest of the season.
32:05The other thing is look at your leagues. A lot of leagues are like, let's say they're 12 person leagues.
32:11Six teams make the playoffs. Two of them have buys.
32:14You don't have to come out three and one.
32:16You can sneak into the playoffs as a fifth or sixth seed.
32:20I just look at it like if he's anywhere near himself, we're talking about a huge discount.
32:25And I think the Giants are going to be better on offense this year than when Malik Nabors was the wide receiver six in fantasy.
32:32They were legitimately 31st in points per game when Malik Nabors on the field.
32:36That's not going to happen this year. Here are the four players last year that had a 30% plus target rate.
32:42Jackson Smith and Jigba, Amon Rae St. Brown, Jamar Chase, Justin Jefferson.
32:45Those are the four players last year that had a 30% target rate.
32:49Malik Nabors had a 30% target rate in 2024.
32:51This is the potential to be an elite, elite player, obviously in a bad offense.
32:56But still, I mean, in fantasy, you can't get it all.
32:5930% target rate, you're almost guaranteed to score like a ton of points.
33:02Josh, why were you so shocked after a thousand episodes of Hayden that Hayden wanted Malik Nabors?
33:07I mean, because I think we recorded a show two weeks ago where we thought the sky was falling with Malik Nabors.
33:14Then Jordan Ronan says it's not going to be that bad.
33:17And I'm like, all right, I don't know fucking better than Jordan Ronan.
33:20He's only with the team every day of his life.
33:23I made the Malik Nabors thumbnail and it just says, it's bad, with Malik Nabors on it.
33:28That was because of you. That was your part of the segment, not mine.
33:32He's moving ADP. He's higher on neighbors than anyone else in the fantasy football industry.
33:36It's incredible. Let's get a new thumbnail going. Okay.
33:39Every now and then I like to pretend like, you know, as someone who is a business minor, I like to pretend I know anything.
33:46And I just like quote Warren Buffett and you sound like you're smart.
33:50But I do think there is like a couple, the two Warren Buffett things I always think about are just be bold
33:56when everyone's fearful and be fearful when everyone's bold.
33:59Which basically means like if everyone's being a little bitch, like go get, go for it.
34:03And everyone's kind of being reckless. Like, I like, yeah, maybe it was me a little bitch about Malik Nabors.
34:09And Hayden's like, just take him. And then I look at Luther Burden and everyone's like, take a Luther Burden over like,
34:15you know, the guy, like the guys we were just talking about.
34:18I'm like, yeah, that's a little nuts. So I get what you're saying, Hayden, where you're like, if Malik Nabors comes back
34:25and it's fine, it's like probably the single biggest miss there is.
34:28I'm incredibly, I don't know. What do you, DK, have you been swayed?
34:32I'm incredibly biased as a Giants fan. And I'm, yeah, I think he, yeah.
34:36I mean, obviously there is an injury fear here and he might not be himself right away, but he is an elite, elite player.
34:43You know, Hayden laid it out. Like watching him, he is, he's on that Jamar Chase level of explosiveness and power and
34:49body control, hands, run after the catch. He has like an entire, he has the entire skill set.
34:54It's easy to forget how fucking good he was in college and how good he was immediately in the NFL.
35:00So, yeah, I think this is a, a worthy risk.
35:03Um, and I, I am swayed. I don't, I don't know what I'm going to make of the Giants offense, but I
35:09do think he's just going to be the only pat, the only talent, like super talented pass catcher in this offense.
35:15The other guys they have are Darius Slayton, who I don't know what injured.
35:19He's injured himself right now too, by the way.
35:21Yeah, there we go. And Calvin Austin, you know, um, Malachi Fields, who they drafted in the third round.
35:27Like this is the target competition we're talking about.
35:29Isaiah likely. Yeah, exactly. Isaiah likely is another interesting one.
35:32Can I, can I flip it? This is a, Hayden just did a bullish on injuries.
35:37Um, take. Can I do a bearish on injuries?
35:39Take please. Say one of my favorite sleepers is Tyrone Tracy of the Giants.
35:43Watch one, watch one video of Cam Scadaboo and tell me this guy's going to stay healthy this year.
35:49You can't convince me. He said, I'm not going to hurt myself.
35:52He said, I'm hurting himself. He said it. You call him a liar.
35:56You're going to call him a liar. This guy's doing fricking backflips in some, I don't even know what context.
36:01Some people would say that when you break your tibia and you get 95% of the weight of a backflip, that's, that's good.
36:08There's not a player I trust less to stay healthy than Cam Scadaboo.
36:12Is that what you kind of want from your running back though?
36:15Like you want to be kind of a savage.
36:18You're like, um, I don't, I look, this is part, part joking.
36:21This is only half serious, but like betting on Scadaboo to stay healthy to me feels like really risky and scary.
36:27And he's going, I think he's 39th overall player right now.
36:30Like he's next to Malik neighbors. It's not cheap to get him.
36:34Um, so if you really, you know, if you, if you believe that he's not going to stay healthy, which I, that's
36:40what I believe, you know, grabbing Tracy, who's proven to be a serviceable starter when they, when they, when he gets the
36:46opportunity, um, you know, last year he, when, after Scadaboo went out, he finished as the, let's see here.
36:52Uh, shoot. I had it in front of me.
36:54He was the RB 18 in half PBR points per game.
36:57And then you can get this guy really, really late.
37:00And that was, this was on a bad, really bad giants team.
37:03So if the most, uh, if the most, uh, naturally entertaining NFL streamer, Cam Scadaboo gets injured, you can arbitrage it with Tyron Tracy.
37:10Is that what you're rooting for? Yes. Um, and it's like, you know, I think Tracy's like a decent player.
37:16He's obviously, he obviously got sort of market corrected by Scadaboo.
37:19Um, but you know, Tracy averaged 14 touches game last year in 15 games and he's a good pass catcher.
37:25Um, he had in, in the stretch after Scadaboo got hurt, which was week nine on, he had 32 targets, which was 12th among running backs.
37:32Like he, they were using him in the passing game.
37:35Um, this is not a very exciting pick, obviously, but such an old man boomer thing.
37:40You're just like, look at, you're watching the news being like, what's going on in the cities?
37:44Like you're basically just sitting there like, what are these kids up to their backflips in there?
37:49Oh, I don't know this streamer. Why are you saying, why are you going on this stream?
37:54I don't like this young guy. I don't like the cut of his jib.
37:58That is basically what you're doing. Yeah. I mean, look, we, we saw Cam Scadaboo doing backflips, but I've also seen DK do three kickflips in a row.
38:06Like this should be someone that DK should appreciate.
38:09Skateboard DK would love Cam Scadaboo. Yes. And think asthma's fake.
38:12Yes. Yeah. Um, he also landed a kick or a backflip the month prior.
38:16We know he's capable. You know, I watched him do it in the softball game.
38:20He's doing, he's doing the fact that he's doing backflips is what I'm going to be honest.
38:25If he, he got, he almost landed the backflip and it's July.
38:28I don't need him to nail the backflip to like August 30th.
38:32Like he's got time. He's done it. He's done it.
38:35Thank you. It's like Mike McDaniel talking to Quentin Johnson being like, Hey, I don't need you to turn on your routes
38:41yet until we get to training camp. You know, right now it's just run straight and fast.
38:46And that's all I need until, you know, we get to.
38:49It's not the twisties. Like he's a mobile. It's not a permanent issue.
38:52Heifetz. What did he do when he was a kid?
38:55He ran into telephone poles all the time as a hobby.
38:58You don't have to be a boomer for that to worry you.
39:02Worry me. I want a thousand of them. That's the whole reason I plug.
39:06People run into telephone poles. I want to plug in my fantasy football lineup.
39:10I don't want to know what they think about asthma.
39:13I don't want to know what he thinks about head injuries.
39:16I don't want to hear him talk to streamers.
39:18I want to watch him play football. I want him.
39:21I want him to yell. Whoa. Like whenever he can.
39:24Like he's Ric Flair. And then I want him to like, I don't know.
39:28I want him to sit. Your team sure is something, man.
39:31Between Dart and Skadaboo. My God. I. It's a Gen Z.
39:34Like. They are. You know, it's so funny. They really are the first Gen Z.
39:39True Gen Z team. Skadaboo and Dart. The Giants really are such a Gen Z team.
39:43Malik Nabors shit talking. The fucking friends. Odell is acting that way too.
39:47Oh. Odell. Juju. Juju. Juju. The oldest 29 year old in the world.
39:51Hayden, you went to USC, right? I was in class with Juju.
39:54I played. What class did you take? Yeah. What class did Juju have?
39:58It was like some sports business bullshit. Yeah. It was.
40:00It was a nothing class. Did he go to class?
40:03He went on occasion. Adore Jackson was there. You know.
40:06Wow. True NFL stars. Yeah. This is a Gen Z team though.
40:10I agree. It's weird. It blows my mind to think that Dave Gettleman gave Adore Jackson too much money for the Giants.
40:16Now that like John Harbaugh signing Juju Smith-Schuster that like freaks me out a little.
40:20Wow. The. Yeah. I'm really concerned for the Giants.
40:23I am happy to get unbiased opinions. I just keep thinking of like, I guess he.
40:27As someone who's seen people skewer the Giants for 15 years, I can just see the Giants moving on from Matt Nagy
40:33and Greg Roman next year and everyone kind of pilloring them and just being like, I don't know.
40:39I just. It's my one thing is I would have felt a lot better about the Giants if the Browns didn't hire Todd Monk.
40:45And it's like this one. Yes. Like crossroads thing that if the Giants were able to get Todd Monk as their OC
40:52and their play caller, I would have felt like much better about this offense.
40:56But then the drop down to Matt Nagy just gives me way more concern.
41:00Well, at the end of the day, Matt Nagy has been with Andy Reid forever.
41:04And Andy Reid was like, we're, we got to move on.
41:07We're good. We got to move our separate ways, which that's not good when a coach who has had a guy has him leave.
41:14And Jim Harbaugh has been with Greg Roman forever.
41:16And then he moved on from his friend, Greg Roman and had it.
41:20And John had to hire him. And I'm like, that's also bad.
41:24You have two guys running the offense who are basically like they're longtime collaborators are like, we think the game has moved beyond you.
41:30They're Milton from the office. They just put him in the basement and hope that he quits.
41:35They are. It's like they're, they're just pre-COVID schemes.
41:38Like Greg Roman's a pre-COVID scheme. And I'm really concerned for the Giants.
41:41I don't know. I'm just really worried about the, everyone agreeing that John Harbaugh was an amazing hire for the Giants while
41:48Ravens fans don't give a shit that he's gone.
41:50Just is like that. I don't know. There's some parallels to the Pete Carroll thing last year.
41:55Yes. It's very similar. If you take out all the, like an adult in the room, finally.
42:00And then you look at it and you're like, what is, I don't know.
42:04Anyway, we'll see how Nate, we'll see if he actually can practice in the middle of August.
42:09We'll see what happens in the neighbors' recovery. Speaking of the Chargers though, I will say my favorite team entering the Chargers.
42:15So I think while the last 20 years in a row, people have said the Chargers, this is the year.
42:21I think this is the year for the Chargers.
42:23I know the last 20 times people said it, they've been wrong.
42:27But it's the meme of the guy digging and trying to find the gold, right?
42:31Like stopping right before they get there. Exactly. Diamond hands on the Chargers.
42:35I really think that Chargers have a chance to be the cheat code for fantasy football in 2026.
42:40I think there's a chance you could stack the entire Chargers team on your fantasy league, which sounds insane because it's the
42:46Chargers and you're betting they're stay healthy. But I think that Justin Herbert is the best quarterback that's ever played in a Kyle Shanahan-esque system.
42:53And that's what Mike McDaniel is going to bring.
42:56And I also think Mike McDaniel replacing Greg Roman as the Chargers offensive coordinator is the biggest upgrade at offensive coordinator we've
43:02seen in the NFL since Sean McVay took over from Jeff Fisher 10 years ago.
43:06And it is hard to wrap your mind around or project how much better everyone will get when Mike McDaniel is working
43:13with Justin Herbert and an actual offensive line. And I understand, so it's like, well, they could get hurt.
43:18Yes, that is possible. But if they don't, I don't think people are prepared for the upside.
43:23Steven Ruiz and I used to joke, who Steven Ruiz here works here at the Ringer and is great, is just brilliant.
43:29We used to joke that if Justin Herbert played for Kyle Shanahan, we thought he could break Peyton Manning's passing touchdown record
43:35because Kyle Shanahan's thing is all about simplicity and creating space and allowing players to make fast decisions.
43:40And Justin Herbert is one of the fastest processors in the NFL.
43:44He's better than two at it, even though two is a good quarterback.
43:48But like Herbert is so much better. And the Chargers offensive line at his strength is so much better.
43:53And I just think every single player on the Chargers you could convince me is a great value.
43:58Mike McDaniel has compared O'Mearian Hampton to Terrell Davis, who made the Hall of Fame after basically four seasons.
44:03Keaton Mitchell is basically going to be the Devon Achan.
44:06And maybe that won't work, but he's going 140th in drafts, which is people take kickers and defenses before Keaton Mitchell will
44:13be off the board as the Chargers backup running back.
44:15And if he sucks, you can cut him. But the two guys for me to keep coming back to are Lad McConkie,
44:22who Ryan Heath at Fantasy Points that you referenced earlier, Josh, said he wrote this great article about two receiver sets, three receiver sets.
44:29Why was Jackson Smith the Jigba offensive player the leader last year?
44:32And Ryan Heath said that the most likely player that replicate JSN's usage in season is Lad McConkie.
44:37And guess what? If he gets hurt, then Quentin Johnson is another player that is going outside the top 90 picks, even
44:43though he's probably going to be the Jalen Waddell version of this Chargers team.
44:47Every single player on this team is valuable. I think Justin Herbert might win MVP.
44:52So I just think that this is like the most obvious thing that's hiding in plain sight.
44:56I know everyone keeps talking about Mike McDaniel for the Chargers coordinator, but I don't think people have actually thought what the ceiling will look like.
45:04And the ceiling is that they're the best offense in the NFL.
45:07And you actually could get every single player on the offense if you really wanted to.
45:12Yeah. Here's a whole episode for you. Hi, Fitz.
45:14Like one question that we wish could have answered prior to the season.
45:18For me, it would be, is injury luck finally on the Charger side this year?
45:22And if that's the case, if it is, then I think the only mispriced player in a negative way is Arande Gadsden in drafts.
45:29And then all of the Chargers are kind of underpriced.
45:32Like if we look at it, offensive line combinations, which by the way, a lot of teams that make the playoffs and
45:38then go on to win the Super Bowl and actual contenders have good and healthy offensive lines.
45:43And injury luck is on their side. Continuity. We all know the Chargers last year, the five starters that played the most
45:49for them, which also included some guy named DeKellis at left tackle.
45:53That was only 16.5% of their snaps. Easily 32nd across the league last year.
45:57So like they had eight left tackles. But the craziest part of that Heifetz is yes, both their tackles got hurt and
46:03both their tackles are awesome, but they also went into the season with the plan of this guard center guard combination.
46:09And those guys played and they sucked. They were horrible.
46:12And now they have all been replaced. We actually have an entire episode with Ryan Heath about that exact article.
46:18If people want to check it out on our channel, because I'm right there with you as much as I've hesitations about
46:24like Omar and Hampton a little bit in terms of how he runs and if he's as good as these other guys,
46:30I don't care about my individual evaluation. It's going to be electric with him in this Mike McDaniel offense.
46:35I can say the same thing about QJ. I don't love every single aspect of his game.
46:40And I test, I don't care. I am drafting a lot of Quentin Johnson.
46:44So this is one of those where I'm kind of putting my individual biases aside.
46:49And I love Ladd McConnake. So I'm going to select him as much as possible and just drafting as many Chargers as I can in baseball this season.
46:56I looked at the highest passing touchdown seasons since 2016 because I was looking at like the Shanahan Matt Ryan season.
47:02That's kind of my my thing. And I was looking at just the Shanahan tree.
47:07And that is five of the top nine passing touchdown seasons over the last decade have been Shanahan tree guys.
47:12Rogers with the floor Stafford last year with McVay, Joe Burrow, Baker Mayfield with Liam Cohen, Matthew Stafford.
47:18Once again, I'm the Sean McVay. Matt Ryan's on that list.
47:21Rogers did it again. And then the other ones is like my homes, Tom Brady, Lamar Jackson, like total aliens and whatever schemes they're running.
47:28Yeah, like this could go absolutely crazy. I will say the interior offensive line.
47:32It still is. You know, the commanders just cut Tyler B.
47:35Odds for some reason. I don't know why they did that.
47:38That was a misread of the center market. That was that was really bad.
47:42That was total misread. And then Cole Strange is the right guard.
47:45And then their left guard is a center who's now switching positions to left guard from Florida rookie there.
47:51So I think that they're still gonna have some issues.
47:54I think McDaniel is gonna take care of this.
47:56I love loud McConkie. And Herbert's like riding that threshold where if you can get them late enough, I think if you've
48:03kind of filled your flex and Herbert's now your starting quarterback, I think that's where I'd be pretty soaked out of them.
48:09Heifetz mentioned the upgrade in offensive coordinator going from Rowan to McDaniel.
48:12And then I mentioned this before. I think this is potentially one of the biggest quarterback upgrades offensive coordinator could have going from Tua, who is like limited.
48:20Obviously, he does some things very well, like processing, getting the ball out quickly.
48:24But like in terms of physical limits. Yeah. There's no one is more physically limited.
48:28I think in the NFL as a starting caliber quarterback than Tua.
48:32And Herbert is maybe the freakish, like most freakish athlete other than Josh Allen.
48:36The real most are unlimited. Apologies to Russell Wilson.
48:38Yeah. Just to throw a little cold water on Austin, just drop this note in our chat, which is a good point.
48:45I need a cold shower. From week three to week 10.
48:48This is the Chargers schedule. Road bills, road Seahawks, home Broncos, road Chiefs, road Rams, home Texans, road Ravens.
48:53Okay. That's scary. Didn't love that. That is the, I think, obviously, apart from just being, you know, snake bit.
48:59So there'll be bad for them and then everyone will get hurt through 10 weeks.
49:03And then or just trade for them after the shitty thing.
49:06No, that is a little scary. Part of me is like, yeah, some of those could be shootouts.
49:11That's fair. Also, like, yeah, it's obvious that this could suck because I'm talking about the Chargers staying healthy and being good
49:18for the 20th year in a row. So I think, I think the way I'd look at it is if you're really
49:24a bullet, basically all these guys, you can jump in wherever you think the water's fine.
49:28I think at the very least you should take Keaton Mitchell as long as he's going outside the first like 12 rounds,
49:35because then it's like, take a free piece. And then if you're just basically like, I don't know if I want like
49:41Kenny Gainwell in the Bucs, then maybe you could get like Quentin Johnson or maybe you don't want Jonathan Brooks off like
49:47who's barely played in the NFL and you end up taking Quentin Johnson.
49:51Because again, if you think Ladd McConkie is going to get hurt and something, Quentin Johnson is going to be the number one receiver.
49:58And in all these receiver sets for a Mike McDaniel Herbert offense.
50:01And I don't love Quentin Johnson as a player, but he no longer is like the worst receiver in the NFL at catching the football.
50:08He got closer to average and he's a perfect fit for Mike McDaniel with crossers and all these things he does.
50:14He fits with, and again, getting Quentin Johnson running before pre-line of scrimmage, which Mike McDaniel does more than anyone like John.
50:21I mean, he had a huge touchdown versus Jim Harbaugh's Michigan.
50:24I mean, yeah, like run after the catch in space.
50:26He's dangerous. It's perfect for Mike McDaniel. And then if you are actually bullish beyond that, you're again, if you want to
50:33free, you can get a Rondé Gadsden, the tight end, Ladd McConkie.
50:36I think he's going to be the number one where I think getting so get a charger on your team.
50:42How much charger is how much you think it's whether I'm talking to my ass or not, that they'll stay healthy.
50:48Maybe you don't care about the schedule, but I'm just, I don't want to miss this.
50:52I want to ask Josh and Hayden what they make of the Keaton Mitchell versus Omar and Hampton split.
50:58And basically like, I think part of me thinks I'm wish cast, wish casting the Keaton Mitchell thing a little bit too much because I love Keaton Mitchell.
51:06It is a little weird. The Ravens were just like, yeah, we're good.
51:09Go ahead. Leave. It's kind of the same thing that we were talking about earlier with the coaches.
51:15Um, and you know, like comparing him to HN is exciting, but like Hampton is going to get the vast majority of the volume.
51:21Isn't he like, how, how do you guys see this split going in reality versus, you know, thinking about McDaniel, putting the
51:28wanted poster up in the, in the, in the facility and like getting excited about that stuff.
51:33I mean, I'm, I'm excited about Brennan Thompson because he, because he was like calling him a Tyree killer or whatever.
51:38Um, but yeah, what do you guys think about this Keaton Mitchell, um, Hampton split and like, what do you really expect this to be?
51:46DK isn't Keaton Mitchell, like the perfect player for our fancy football bubble to obsess over for three to four months in
51:52the summer when he makes the move into Mike McDaniels offense, because you know, you can sort by, you know, rushing yards are expected or explosive plays.
52:00And, you know, depending on underlying metrics you want to look at, uh, he ranks super high in, in all of those,
52:06uh, again, I am not obsessed with Amar and Hampton as an individual talent.
52:10I also think that this is the perfect system for him where Mike McDaniel offenses during his time in Miami ranked fifth
52:16in yards per rush for running backs, fifth in success rate and first in explosive play rate.
52:21We know Hampton had a 0.27 miss tackles force rate this past year.
52:25What McDaniel is so good as giving these guys space and just allowing them the ability to get in the open area
52:31and use whatever traits that they have. And then Martin Hampton is just a big ass dude who's super freaking fast.
52:37When he gets rumbling, it is a sight to see for sure.
52:40He's a runaway beer truck. So I, I think it's going to be at worst 70 30.
52:45I'm worried that Kamani Vidal is going to play the passing downs because he's the best pass protector.
52:50And I thought Hampton was terrible in pass protection.
52:53He's a good receiver, but the pass protection part is going to be an issue.
52:57So if like, if it's not like 70 30, it's actually, you know, keep that split, but also it's 20% Kamani Vidal.
53:03That's where it's like, okay, I'm trying to make the math work at 14th overall.
53:08So I have Hampton like 22nd overall. I think it's going to be like outstanding when he gets the ball in his
53:14hands, but I don't think that he was like super consistent as a rusher.
53:18I thought he was sometimes a little bit indecisive.
53:20You never know. That's just because he didn't trust the blocking, which he obviously shouldn't, but I thought that he was like by himself indecisive.
53:27And I do think that Keaton Mitchell is like going to get eight touches a game.
53:32I think they, they have to, they gave him five, $5 million guaranteed $9 million over the next two seasons.
53:38Like that's like Rico Dowdle money. Like we're not like questioning if Rico Dowdle is going to get the ball.
53:43Um, the, the, this is such an obvious fit.
53:46The money is there. Um, to me, like the Hampton evaluation, I think it's just like if it's three running backs and
53:52it's actually Kamani Vidal out there as well, like that's going to be a pretty, pretty big bummer for a top 15 pick.
53:59One final point, DK, do we have to decide between the two?
54:02Because I know, you know, we're not going to get exactly what we got in 2023 from that Dolphins offense with this
54:08Chargers offense, but in that 2023 season for Devon HN's rookie year and where he Mostert, you know, those guys were running
54:15back three and running back four and points per game.
54:18Now where he most are, it was what over 30 and had the most touchdowns other than John Riggins for a 30 plus year old.
54:25And you know, Devon HN, it took him some time, but then he became one of the most explosive players in the league.
54:31I guess my point is, however, the rushing tack is going to be, it's going to be incredibly successful.
54:37And I just want to draft the pieces that are attached to it.
54:40And, uh, I'm surprised at how in on Hampton I am this year.
54:44I love that. I'm probably wrong. Cause everyone's always wrong about the charges, but everyone who's ever played for Mike McDaniel had the best performance of their career.
54:52And I keep thinking about that. Uh, Hayden, another person I like a lot this year is Christian Watson.
54:57And I was hoping someone would bring me down to earth.
55:01Cause I just, this is a player I don't understand why everyone's not as high as me.
55:05And I saw you on, uh, he was on your list, which made me feel a little less crazy.
55:11What do you like season like calendar season as he finishes the wide receiver 17 on a per game basis?
55:16Like that is, that makes sense. And that goes back to the Malik neighbor stuff.
55:21Like I literally just watched Christian Watson do this, who did it when the playoffs or week 18 and well, at least
55:27Malik neighbors tore his ACL and you know, week four, but these freak athletes who have youth on their size, like on
55:33their side, they can go absolutely crazy coming back from some of these seasons.
55:37He looked really good to me. Um, he's obviously the perfect fit for what Jordan love wants to do down the field,
55:43but it was not just like deep shot after deep shot last year for Christian Watson.
55:48There's a little bit more versatility to his game.
55:51They got rid of wicks. They let Dobbs walk.
55:53There's not going to be a rotation anymore. He's going to be on the field every single snap.
55:58I think Matthew golden will be on the field for almost every snap.
56:02And then Jaden Reed in the slot. I don't understand why there's not more optimism here.
56:07Like I haven't ranked back to back with Jameson Williams is Jameson Williams that much better than Christian Watson in real life.
56:13I think that's a true toss up. And I think there's a decent chance that Christian Watson is going to lead this
56:19team in targets and there's no chance that's going to happen with Jameson Williams, unless there's like an unpredictable injury.
56:25Um, they go more than around apart. I think that Christian Watson should be right next to Terry McLaurin, Jameson Williams, all those guys.
56:32Uh, I think the more I think about that, I think I'd rather have Christian Watson than Terry McLaurin straight up.
56:38I think he's like a little bit better of a player.
56:41Uh, and this offense is a little bit more bankable, uh, from just watching Jordan love all, all these years.
56:46Yeah. I mean, Watson totally changed his game and the usage with him change as well.
56:51Like we can go back to his rookie season and just the high variance of it, that he was running so pure
56:57and so hot on the downfield passes from Aaron Rogers.
57:00Whereas this last year, I just pulled some of the stats of like just the targets that were given to him and
57:06they were just way more gimmies, which is great.
57:09Like we're not living on these 20 plus yard passes over and over again for Christian Watson anymore.
57:14Instead, he's the go-to player for them on second medium go-to player for them on, on third and short.
57:19I mean, just pure out routes that jumped in the first, what three years of his career at 7.7% of the routes
57:26that he ran and his targets that he got up to 35% this past season.
57:30Whenever you think of Jordan love, it's these out patterns over and over and over again, along with the deep posts and
57:36the corner routes on top of it. So I think Watson is the premier player pass catcher in this offense now other
57:42than Tucker craft, but even how they win is totally different too.
57:46So you're not going to get any negative feedback from Christian Watson and us.
57:50Uh, high fits guys like Christian Watson going. So later, why I kind of feel comfortable taking like a bunch of running
57:56backs and being like, maybe I'll just grab Derek Henry in if, when he falls in round three, cause people are scared
58:02of taking Derek Henry as the oldest running back in the NFL.
58:06And then I can get Christian Watson as my second or maybe even third receiver, depending how things go.
58:11And I just feel like that is a cheat code.
58:14And that's what makes me want to like get quarterback later and all these things.
58:18I just, I agree with Hayden. I think that the upside for Christian Watson, cause not it's so it's a fool's errand
58:25to be like, who's this year's JSN? It's like when people are like the giants or this year's Patriots.
58:30I'm like, well, there is no Patriots this year.
58:33No 80 to one team is going to make the Superbowl.
58:36But if you are just trying to pick which receiver of that, like next tier down is going to maybe join the upper echelon.
58:42I'm like, yeah, to me it is more like Christian Watson.
58:46I wouldn't be shocked if it was a Mecca, a healthy Malik neighbors.
58:49I agree that like, I think Terry McLaurin is like a harder path there.
58:53Like Watson just, he's, he's just a playmaker. I think he transformed the Packers offense when he came back.
58:59DK, am I high on my own supply? No, I think I have a blind spot for, with Christian Watson a little
59:05bit where it's just, I think about him getting hurt and that is kind of a turn.
59:10Well, it's not a blind spot. You just watched all the games.
59:13He wasn't there. But yeah, I mean, I think I agree with everything you guys are saying in terms of like the
59:19talent is very obvious and very clear. Big guy who can run like the wind in an offense that we trust, a
59:26play caller that we trust, a quarterback that's been very good.
59:29And there's a lot of variables here that kind of line up for a big season.
59:33Evening by his remorse, buy a new car. I'll be moving in.
59:37Let's get started. Uh, sorry. I think there's been a mistake.
59:40I bought it from Carvana. You what? Yeah. Great price.
59:43I even have seven days to love it or return it.
59:46So there's no... No. No buyer's remorse. More like buyers rejoice.
59:49Ugh. I guess I'll let myself out. Congratulations. I mean it.
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60:21Terms apply. I was going to bring up one more guy if you guys want to talk about him.
60:26Because I don't know where to land on him.
60:29He's certainly not a good value necessarily or a sleeper, but Basial Tootin for the Jags is a player that I wanted
60:35to bring up because I don't know where I land on him.
60:39I think I want to be in on him, but there's just a lot of uncertainty.
60:43Can you remind us of the Tootin scouting report for those who aren't versed in which is intense football?
60:49It is like electric speed and tackle breaking and runaways, like big plays basically and a good pass catcher, but kind of
60:55just didn't really show any of that his rookie year and kind of got stuck behind Travis Achan, Travis Etienne.
61:00But going into the season, Etienne, Achan is now on the Saints.
61:04There is this potential for a massive boost in volume for Tootin.
61:07There's just an open, huge amount of open volume in the Jags offense.
61:11In an offense that, you know, with Cohen, Liam Cohen, he's generally speaking had created a lot of opportunity for his running backs.
61:18So whether we're taking Chris Rodriguez or Basial Tootin, that is the question.
61:21I think right now Rodriguez is hurt and that is kind of the tiebreaker for me that I'm rather just take the
61:28explosive guy that has been pretty good when used, you know, near the goal line.
61:32He's thicker guy than I think people give him credit for.
61:35He's small. He's not, he's short, not small kind of deal.
61:38He's like a thick explosive runner with 4'3 speed.
61:41Not a lot of proven production. But I mean, if you look at like last year, I was just like picking out some stats.
61:47I was looking at this. I thought it was interesting.
61:50Among running backs with 200 plus snaps last year, in points per snap, because he didn't play a ton of snaps.
61:56He was like 20% snap rate. Yep. In points per snap, everybody around him is like really good players.
62:02You got the guys in the NFL, Henry, Cook, Gibbs, A-chan, Skadavu, Warren, Jacobs, Jalen Warren, and Josh Jacobs were the guys that are ahead of them.
62:09The guys right below him are Jonathan Taylor, CMC, Bijon, and Travion Henderson.
62:13So that's obviously like a cherry picked stat. But like in terms of points per touch, points per snap, I think he
62:19did show a little bit of potential. So yeah, I haven't actually heard your guys' take on Tune.
62:24So I'm very curious to hear what you think.
62:27No, I said earlier, the question I want answered is that the Chargers have good injury luck.
62:32Maybe the second one is, hey, give me the backfield split of the Jacksonville Jaguars, because we need to get the Liam Cohen backfield correct this year.
62:39And if we do, then that like automatically puts you in playoff contention in your fantasy leagues.
62:44Because just over the last two years when Liam Cohen has called plays, that's Bucky Irving's rookie year.
62:49And then it was Travis A-chan last year, right?
62:52And that's what we have. And that's pretty dang good.
62:55And, you know, whatever offensive line he goes to, whether they invest a lot or not, he has rushing success.
63:01Yes, Tootin is fascinating. Because what? He was like a zero-star recruit, and quote me if I'm wrong here, Hayden and DK,
63:07but like Delaware, and then transferred up to... North Carolina A&T.
63:10I'm way off. And then finished up... He spent one season at North Carolina A&T is what I'm seeing.
63:15He was zero-star, though. And then went to Virginia Tech.
63:18And, you know, what? Liam Cohen and... Who's the boy genius?
63:21Gladstone. James Gladstone. Funny... Dookie Hauser, we call him.
63:24Yeah. Are we sure he's a genius? That's kind of what I'm saying here.
63:28The funniest thing to me was Gladstone said in his interview to become GM of this team is like, oh, yeah, we're going to draft Bachelot Tootin.
63:36And that's like way early in the draft process to say that stuff.
63:39But it seems like he and Liam just care so much about yards over expected and forced missed tackles and all this stuff.
63:46Final point is I think he just lost his balance way too much last season.
63:50Like there were opportunities where he just tripped over his own foot after making the first man miss.
63:55And so that turned, you know, a 17 or 27 yard game into a seven yard run.
64:00And that just happened way too often for a guy that played 21% of offensive snaps.
64:05But at the same time, when you lose someone like Travis Achan and you replace it with Bachelot Tootin and Chris Rodriguez,
64:11then at least that seems like there's a lot of money in the bank here and credit that Tootin did behind the
64:17scenes for him to like have at least the first opportunity to be the lead back.
64:22And hopefully he just doesn't drop that opportunity. I'm undecided on this one.
64:25I'm just going to listen to John Shipley in training camp.
64:28I will say that the hard part with this is Liam Cohen coached Chris Rodriguez in college.
64:33And Kentucky. Yeah. And Chris Rodriguez went crazy. And then that's who they bring in.
64:38And then it was one of those when we were reacting to the free agency week.
64:42It's like, oh, Chris Rodriguez to Jacksonville. And everyone's like, oh, perfect.
64:46Bachelot Tootin to the moon. And then like an hour later, it's like for $10 million.
64:50Everyone's like, what? $10 million. That's like a lot more money than I was expecting.
64:54So that's difficult. When I think of Tootin, there was a play that stood out last year.
64:59They ran a screen to the right. All the offensive linemen went to the right.
65:03He went to the left. Now he caught it and scored a touchdown.
65:07He made a couple guys miss. It was unbelievable.
65:10Liam Cohen's like, what do I do with that?
65:12He is going the wrong way. By the way, everybody in Jacksonville was going the wrong way pre-snap.
65:17And during the plays, I don't know what the hell was going on there.
65:21So I don't know what Liam Cohen thinks of Tootin.
65:24I know that he thinks highly of Chris Rodriguez.
65:27All the fancy boy stats, by the way, like yards after contact and stuff.
65:31Chris Rodriguez was just straight up better than Tootin.
65:33So it's like one of these hard things where like the nerds want Tootin to matter.
65:38But don't look at the nerd stats from the pros because then you have to admit that Chris Rodriguez is actually good.
65:44So it's one of these we just don't have a good read on it.
65:48I'm just going to listen to Shipley and pretend that the rookie season didn't exist.
65:52Reminds me a lot of Travion Henderson at the Patriots last year where everyone wants Travion Henderson to be this crazy explosive big play on a team.
66:00And then Ramondre Stevenson, even after fumbling, just the coach loves him.
66:04And I'm like Chris Rodriguez is basically going later than Ramondre was last year.
66:08And I could totally see Chris Rodriguez actually being a value because we all want to disappear him.
66:13I will say, I know I just said Keaton Mitchell could be A-Chan, but I think that Basial Tootin, the upside is he's like A-Chan.
66:20Like he is actually probably the fastest running back of actual substance to come in since A-Chan.
66:25A-Chan is underrated vision. But I do think the reason Tootin didn't get so many touches was a combination of he needed more seasoning.
66:31And they were like, well, they knew they were going to let Travis, the artist formerly known as Travis Etienne, go in free agency.
66:38And so they used the tread on the tires and they're like, we'll use these guys this year.
66:43And a lot more this year. But Rodriguez might be better.
66:46And you also have LaQuint Allen eating, what, 15 to 20% of snaps no matter what.
66:51Great pass pro. Yeah. Tremendous pass pro guy. There's all the little things right.
66:55Two minute, four minute, second, third long. Special teams.
66:58He's a madman on special teams too. Yeah. He's wild.
67:00Coach's favorite. To be clear, Chris Rodriguez, surgery on his left foot.
67:04Yep. Don't love surgery on your foot in the summer.
67:07They're saying he's going to be ready for training.
67:09Well, maybe it was like a bunion. But we'll see.
67:12I do think, yes, this is a, I'm kind of in the same boat.
67:16I'm like, I'm excited about Tootin because I'm holding on to my priors.
67:20I liked him coming out. I thought he was a really exciting player.
67:23But a lot of times coaches kind of go with the guy that they trust more.
67:28And that could end up being Rodriguez. But if Rodriguez is hurt, this is kind of moot.
67:33And I think you're going to get a lot of value with Tootin if he is hurt.
67:38If he doesn't play early on, like that is Tootin to the moon.
67:41These are a lot of favorite players before we go.
67:44Are there any parting thoughts on just the season, these players, anything, Josh, Hayden, anything that sticks out to you after talking about this?
67:51I'll just say there are a lot of players we dislike as well.
67:55So it sounds like for this episode, we like the entire league.
67:58That is not the case. Like if you want to bring up Marvin Harrison Jr., Hayden might just lead the program.
68:04I will. No, we always joke at the end of every season, we write down things that no matter what, we will not talk ourselves.
68:11It's like the Odyssey basically. It's like siren songs.
68:14And one of them was I will not rank Marvin Harrison over Michael Wilson no matter what anyone tells me, no matter what.
68:20No, I'm not going to. I have to. I have to.
68:24I know. I lied also. First of all, go.
68:26I'm going to keep you guys for one more thing.
68:29You guys have been very generous with your time.
68:31Please go to YouTube. It's Josh and Hayden on YouTube.
68:34Yahoo Fantasy Football launches. What day, Josh? July 27th.
68:37Monday. Go check it out. Their show is unbelievable.
68:39I'm going to keep you even longer. I'm going to ask you real quick, Dad Corner, because all of you guys are dads except me.
68:47My brother just had a baby. I actually changed a diaper for the first time two weeks ago.
68:52Oh. Because they're trying to get me to babysit immediately and actually not look at their phone.
68:57Any dad stories, dad advice? High Fitz, let me ask you.
69:00Or uncle advice. With that diaper, how old are we talking here with the child?
69:04Like is it still that super dark brown shit?
69:06Or is it now? Yeah, month old. Dijon mustard.
69:09Yeah. Okay. That changes quickly. I've been told it will be, you know, man never steps in the same river twice.
69:15I just took my six and a half month old to Ireland.
69:18And both times we landed, that landing forced him to have a blowout.
69:22So both times I had to allow the entire plane to exit as I was in the tiny, tiny bathroom of an
69:28airplane as he's pitching a fit, trying to change his blowout along with his clothes on top of it.
69:34So I'm not sure what landings do to him, but something nasty.
69:37Yeah, it's tough. DK had a blowout last time we were in a plane.
69:41Yeah, yeah. That was tough. Landings, man. It's genetics for me.
69:44All right. So Hayden, how old is you? You have a two-year-old?
69:48Yeah, approaching two. My advice would be don't have a kid in October if you cover the sport.
69:53That's one piece of advice. That's why they traded you.
69:56We are looking at it. Now, credit to me.
69:58I took like two weeks off and I got right back in there.
70:02So I think I earned some stripes there. I think for you, Danny, if you can prove that you can change a
70:08diaper and feed them, your brother is going to love you.
70:11Like, I'm trying to get my brother to – that can trust him, that he's willing to change a diaper.
70:17I'm not there yet. So babysitting becomes harder. So if you want to step up, like you changing the diaper this early
70:23on, like that's a great sign for the family dynamic right there.
70:27You got to learn how to do a swaddle.
70:29Do you know how to swaddle yet? Oh, man.
70:32I got competitive. I've tried to swaddle my cat to cut his nails and I can't even do that.
70:37It's probably much harder actually than a baby. But the swaddle, you just kind of tie them up like a little caterpillar or whatever.
70:44Wow. It's pretty complicated. They have – well, now they have the Velcro straps and stuff.
70:49We quickly – we tried to do the blankets and then you're like, oh, they got the ones with the Velcro.
70:55They have new technology. Yeah, the technology is going fast.
70:57My biggest learning lesson has been as soon as you nail down a routine, that routine changes.
71:02So like for when my son was, I don't know, two months old, I had this whole routine that would span almost
71:0945 minutes to get him down to like finally go to sleep.
71:12And I would like sit him up at first so he could burp and we'd listen to the same songs and rock back and forth.
71:19And then I put him in his clothes and then I did some more rocking so he'd fall asleep.
71:24Then I swaddled him. And as soon as we freaking got that nailed, he didn't want to do that anymore.
71:30Never get your hopes up with sleep. Never get your hopes up.
71:34So that changed quickly. So now we're in a different one.
71:37Yeah, you just got to be able to roll with the punches really for the first like four years.
71:42Four years? Three years, maybe? I don't know. Four years is a long time.
71:46They also get more fun, you know, as every month they're doing new bits.
71:50Like my son's like officially doing bits now. So that's like that's that's that's that gets exciting.
71:55Does he like Marvin Harrison Jr. this year? Is that his bit?
71:58No, no. I've taught him well. What's a bit from a two-year-old?
72:02Oh, well, he says like bye. Like we had a we got a bounce house for the Fourth of July and he
72:08waves bye bye to the backyard every single time to the bounce house.
72:12We the gardeners are a big thing. He'll like chase down the gardeners and then he wants to vacuum.
72:17We bought him two toy vacuums and he just wants to vacuum all day.
72:21So whenever we go pick. Yeah, exactly. So we're teaching him chores and stuff.
72:25He doesn't know it's it. Maybe it's my bit of teaching him the chores.
72:29It's not his bit. But he's going along with the bit, which is all you could ask for.
72:34That's great. I'm still trying to get Calvin to like help around the house.
72:38It's an ongoing battle. So that's a good sign.
72:41Calvin knows every whale that there's ever been. Calvin can name like 150 birds based on these like bird.
72:46Wow. Like flashcards. He can't do the bird calls like that one.
72:50I was going to ask. He's not going to go viral.
72:53All right. Well, you guys have been very generous of your time.
72:56Thank you for the data advice. Thank you. Thank you guys players.
73:00I'll just take these guys and that way I'll do it.
73:03If they do well, then it's my credit. And then if they do terribly, I'm just going to blame you guys.
73:09So thank you for that. Thank you, DK. Thank you, Josh and Hayden.
73:12Please go check out the YouTube. Please just check out their pod.
73:16It's fantastic. Coming out July 27th. Thank you to Cam.
73:19Thank you to Nikhil. Thank you to Austin. Thank you to Abu.
73:22Thank you to everyone behind the scenes. Thank you to Craig, wherever you are in Hawaii.
73:27Please get tan. And Craig always says a millennial banger.
73:29So I'm going to put on a hanger. Hayden, you have to come up with just a millennial banger song from whenever
73:36you were in high school or college because we're the same age.
73:39So thank you, Lord. Lord. Hayden, what do you got here?
73:42Can you think of a song? I'm thinking like any of the Akon songs.
73:46That's where I went to. T-Pain, Sprung. Yeah. Anything T-Pain, Akon.
73:49I love that. Fantastic. Actually, you know what? I had a song like queued up here in case Heifetz sent it to me.
73:56Remember Cyclone by Baby Bash featuring T-Pain? Hell yeah.
73:58Hell yeah. That song is like in a dance club or like in a bar where people are dancing.
74:04Like nothing is going to set the dance floor off more than that song, I feel like.
74:09Danny, I wore this Alice in Chains shirt because I knew you were a Seattle guy.
74:13I didn't know if you were an Alice in Chains guy or not, but that's my favorite band.
74:18Oh my God. I heard we heard some Alice in Chains in the bar the other day.
74:23I went to the Mariners game and they were playing Alice in Chains.
74:27I was like, this is so cliche, but I actually love it.
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